Oil vs Water

[kingknight]

Curious about your preferences for oil or water as a lubricant. Personally I prefer diamond and wet stones which require water. I find water is an easier clean up than oil. In your opinion which is the better vehicle for moving swarf?

[FRJ]

I have been sharpening on stones of various kinds for over fifty years. I stopped using oil early on.
I could not see the need for a lubricating medium in the process of removing metal from the edge of a blade.
It serves no productive purpose that I can see. I don't want the blade to glide across the stone.
I want the stone to abrade the blade edge. And it will do that when using oil. We all know that.
But without the oil and with the use of water I think the process occurs much more efficiently.
As for removing swarf, I am quick to rid the stone of that too. It can literally be splashed away with water.
Having the swarf residue rolling under the cutting edge and impeding the metal removal process is something
I also like to avoid. Clean stone, clean edge, clean fast cut.
I use water stones most of the time but I have many other kinds of stones of various grits and sizes that I am quite fond of using and will often reach for them.

[Mumbleypeg]

I’ve also used several kinds of stones. My grandfather taught me how to freehand sharpen when I was about 10 or 12 years old, using both oil and water stones. I haven’t noticed any discernible difference in the results from using either oil or water, but I prefer water for the reasons already mentioned.

Ken

[Doc B]

I can't argue, too much, with the use of water. Guess I've just gotten used to oil on diamond. I know most will probably say you don't need oil on diamond. Mineral oil is cheap. Anyway...I like the knife to slide along and I guess I've just developed a "feel". One advantage to oil...is that (depending on the metal of the knife) is I don't have to worry about residual water in the tang area, or under scales and flushing with WD 40. The vast majority of time, my knives only need a couple of swipes on a 600 or 1000 grit diamond stone, to bring an edge back...so it's quicker to not have to lube up an old traditional knife and worry about the water aspect.
But to the primary point of your question...probably the quick water wash, does get rid of the swarf faster.
One thing for sure...is, although principles are the same...like fingerprints...I think everyone develops their own unique methods. Just read the sharpening forum and you'll get a million ways to do it. I'll never argue with success!

[kingknight]

One thing for sure...is, although principles are the same...like fingerprints...I think everyone develops their own unique methods. Just read the sharpening forum and you'll get a million ways to do it. I'll never argue with success!

One of the reasons I enjoy this forum so much is being able to draw on the knowledge and experience of others, especially the wisdom that goes back generations.

[mrwatch]

I never gave Norton oil stones any thought until I went to watchmakers school. The instructor/teacher on the first day sat us at jewelers lathes. He gave each of us a new lathe tool. Every thing was done free hand. This tool is dull, he took a stone and held the end to the stone and slightly moved it back and forth. That's how you sharpen it and walked away. By the end of the day my finger tip was hurting. In the evening I went over to the micro machine tech. class room and borrowed at jig. I learned about lubes and when to put the stone into the ultrasonic cleaner to get the grit out of it. He would send back my lathe project say the corner was rounded. Finally put the second loop on it and seen it was and that my tool really was not sharp. Passed three project and a balance staff. Last was a winding stem, all from blue prints. He came over to show me how to tun my project around in the collet but I had all ready finished it as it was. He said my tool must have been really sharp! Didn't have to thread it. Speaking of, you wouldn't believe some of the tap and dies and set for watch screws.
So in short yes a dry stone is not a good idea.
Bob

[richard bissell]

A very long time ago an edition of Pop. Science or Pop. Mechanics magazine had an article about sharpening in which they showed micro-photographs of sharpened tools. The pics showing the best edges were of blades which were repeatedly done with stones washed alot with water consistency liquids , which process got rid of the metal particles more effectively than other thicker fluid such as oil.'; unfortunately, some stones are sold with oil already in them...thank you...

[Dinadan]

I have not used a lot of different kinds of stones over the past fifty years, so my knowledge is kind of narrow.

I mostly use soft Arkansas stones. For my pocket stone I often use beer for a lubricant, since that is what I usually have available out on the back porch. It works just fine. So does tea (unsweetened). Other than color unsweetened tea is just water.

For my bigger Arkansas stones that I use in the kitchen I use bacon lard. I strain it through a coffee filter and store it in spice jar. I think it is the best lubricant for oil stones since it is semi solid, easy to handle, free if you eat bacon, and works good.

[jmh58]

I got some new stones in and am deciding on oil or water.. I have sharpened knives for the past 25yrs or so and have used oil on all my stones.. Decisions do I want to try water??? Messy?? I have read all posts here and still undecided..
John

[samb1955]

If you can't decide flip a coin.

[Mumbleypeg]

Decisions do I want to try water??? Messy?? I have read all posts here and still undecided..
John

Both oil and water can be messy depending on how and where you sharpen. I like water because I sharpen at the sink. My grandpa sharpened at a table under a shade tree in the yard - he’d get a bucket full of water and dunk the stone occasionally to wash away the scarf. If you use oil sooner or later you’re going to need to clean the stone, so you’ll probably put it in water eventually anyway. So,why wait?

If you’re like me once you start with water you’ll rarely go back to oil. There are some stones that are advertised as “water stones”. I don’t have one.

Ken

[mrwatch]

Japanese water stones are white and very soft and used for fine Cheff's knifes. Keep them in a bucket of water. when no longer flat you rub two together to flatten it.They can cost over $200 Grit is like 1,000 and much higher. I have mostly Norton brand wet stones.
-----
Both oil and water can be messy depending on how and where you sharpen. I like water because I sharpen at the sink. My grandpa sharpened at a table under a shade tree in the yard - he’d get a bucket full of water and dunk the stone occasionally to wash away the scarf. If you use oil sooner or later you’re going to need to clean the stone, so you’ll probably put it in water eventually anyway. So,why wait?

If you’re like me once you start with water you’ll rarely go back to oil. There are some stones that are advertised as “water stones”. I don’t have one.

Ken

[richard bissell]

Oil versus Water: A friend to my dad advised me to use water; he used his sharpened tools to work with wood and said oil would leave stains and water would not leave stains; water washes away the metal bits more quickly; many decades ago, Pop. Sci. or Mechanics magazine did an article on sharpening where they showed with microphotography that it is the left over metal bits on a stone that were a big factor with damage to an edge that needed to get sharper when using a stone. // Some Japanese water stone makers warn that oil can damage their stones; then those stones wear down faster and are not cheap to replace.//As one responder to your question said, oil costs more than water./best of luck with your pursuits and stay safe...

[marinaio61]

I have used oil since the '50's and don't make a mess, don't clean my stones with water -that's what WD40 is for- and can't understand why anyone would want to intentionally risk getting water in parts of a knife where it could hide long enough to cause damage! I have never had a tool sharpened and properly cleaned stain a wood or leather project, I do both regularly. Guess it comes down to what we all grew up with; I can't argue with the good results I've seen from water stones and I know what results I get from oil stones.

[edge213]

I tend to agree with this post.
I've always used oil. The difference with me is I clean my stones with Comet and hot water.

[FRJ]

and can't understand why anyone would want to intentionally risk getting water in parts of a knife where it could hide long enough to cause damage!

I use compressed air on my pocket knives after sharpening to remove all water to the point of a completely dry knife.
I think there is a concern for loosening covers with compressed air and I am cautious when I use it but I have never had a problem. Sure gets rid of lint.

Welcome here, by the way.

[Mumbleypeg]

I have used oil since the '50's and don't make a mess, don't clean my stones with water -that's what WD40 is for

Thanks. I always wondered what WD-40 was good for. Now I can use up those cans I’ve been given for Christmas. Oh wait, I sharpen with water. Never mind.

I’m being facetious, but in fact I really don’t have a high opinion of WD-40. it’s good for what it was invented for - water displacement. It’s a lousy lubricant, a fair-to-middling solvent, and a great marketing success story. JMO

Ken

[wv trapper]

My Pop showed me how to free hand many years ago and he used water. I now use mineral oil on my Diamond stone to put a working edge on my knife, after getting it where I want I switch to a fine ceramic stick to take any burrs off and finish with a leather strop. I've done this for years and it seems to work for me I guess in the end result it is what works for you.

[jmh58]

I got some new stones in and am deciding on oil or water.. I have sharpened knives for the past 25yrs or so and have used oil on all my stones.. Decisions do I want to try water??? Messy?? I have read all posts here and still undecided..
John

Soo.. I ended up using oil as I have for many yrs.. Guess old habits are hard to break..
John

[JACK OF ALL TIRADES]

Not that I am very good at it but I do it at the sink with Dawn to sharpen and lather it up to get the stone clean. I like to run the stone on the edge and hold the knife, sometimes

[OLDE CUTLER]

When I am using diamond stones, I use none of the above. In other words dry. After a period of sharpening on dry diamond stones, I just take an old paint brush and sweep the debris off. The reason you use water or oil in the first place is to keep the pores of the stones from loading up or clogging with debris. Diamond stones don't have pores, so I run them dry. Other than that, on my other non diamond stones, on Japanese water stones I use water, on carburundom stones I use oil.

[Alien883]

Makes no difference, as long as you have matter that flushes the grit away and make your bevel glide on the stone service...its all good...no tomato ever will ask if you used oil or water on that knife!!!!

[eveled]

I use diamond plates and use hand sanitizer or alcohol or water.

[pitonyak]

The answer to oil, water, or dry depends on who you ask. SharpeningSupplies.com did some testing and they generally state, do not sharpen dry:

https://www.sharpeningsupplies.com/Shou ... -W115.aspx

There is talk about build-up and similar.

Norton India and Crystolon stones. Norton states the following: “Water is less messy, but we recommend using oil as it is more effective than water at keeping the stones from loading.” Also note that “most Norton benchstones are impregnated with oil as part of our manufacturing process.”

Diamond Stones. Sharpening supplies recommends water because there are no pores to fill on diamond plate. If I use water, I always add just a drop or two of Dawn dish washing detergent. I have had rust on my diamond plates when I use water.

The the DMT FAQ states: While we recommend you use DMT® products dry or with water only, it is acceptable to use a variety of lubricants when sharpening with DMT® products. Mineral oil, mineral spirits, kerosene, WD40 can all be used without harming your DMT®.

Best Sharpening Stones recommends Krud Kutter because it works well and is very inexpensive. Obviously Trend recommends their fluid claiming that WD40 (and similar) are too thick causing skating. And their product reduces rust. I find it too expensive.

I often use Smith’s, a non-petroleum based and features built-in stone cleaning agents and rust/corrosion inhibitors. Very happy with it. It has worked fine for me on Arkansas stones as well.

Gatco honing oil also claims usability with Diamond plates, but also with their other sharpening stones. Their Ultimate Diamond Hone Sharpening System includes this oil; well, I think that all of their sharpening systems come with and recommend this oil. It has worked fine for me on Arkansas stones as well.


Shapton Glass Stones. I like them because I do not like soaking. The Shapton FAQ says that although you can use oil, once you use oil you should always use oil. I only use water here.

Water Stones. Water stones, especially those that you soak, I have only used water. I prefer Shapton stones that I do not have to soak, however.

Ceramic stones such as Norton Ascent and Spyderco all claim that they can be used dry. I find that they load less if I spritz them with water. Note that the Spyderco Medium stone (brown) absorbs a lot of water when you do this. I do not always do this, for example, when chip carving or when using my Spyderco Sharpmaker.

Arkansas Stones. I never use these dry and I have only ever used a light oil. The claim is that a light mineral oil prevents clogging better than water. Some testing done by people in the Badger and Blade forum tested with Water, Smith’s honing solution (water soluble version), and a light oil found that with water and with Smith’s the stone would eventually glaze (develop a highly reflective surface from a non-reflective matte surface). A claim is also made that the stone will cut faster and longer when using a light oil. From what I can tell, the coarser the stone, the more likely it will work OK with water, but the pores will still fill faster than with oil. So I do not use water with Arkansas stones.