ID my old sheath knife, please!

[zoogirl]

Hi everyone! Ok, here goes. I'm new here and I'm already yelling for help.
I picked up this badly ground up old hunting knife at an antique shop. It has barely any marking left and so far I've had no luck in identifying it.
The marks on one side of the tang are what appears to be an arrow pointing to a German cross. On the other side are the capital letters ER and what might be an I below them.
The handle is stacked, red and very dark brown.
Overall, the knife seems quite old. The sheath is leather, dry but not crispy and marked Made In England".
Any ideas?! I bought it for a camp knife so the condition wasn't really a concern. As a matter of fact, the idea was to replace my Pal Brand knife which turned out to be too old and cool to abuse!
I'm really curious about it. Thanks for any help!

[Gunsil]

Your knife was made by Wade & Butcher in England and is likely older than your PAL. The handle is leather (the brown part) with red fiber and brass washers. Knife was likely made between 1910 and 1950. W&B made a very good stout knife.

[zoogirl]

Thank you! I guess I'm still looking for a camp knife.
I'm going to try to track down the year on it. I don't know that it's the older knife as my Palis "Pal Brand" not "Pal Blade" putting it pre 1935.
Off to research!

[Gunsil]

Let's see the Pal knife!! Pal was a trademark of Utica Knife and Razor Co, and although most were made in Czechoslavakia or Germany some were made by Union Cut Co. W&B knives like yours were made into the 1950s but they were more prolific in the earlier 1900s. Your W&B is in such poor condition that it will make a good camp knife as it has little collector value due to condition. You will not be able to track down a year on the W&B, they made them exactly the same for a long time and they never changed the marks. It is probably 1920-WW2 but you will not get a closer estimate than that. W&B was trying to compete with Marbles and some of their knives look quite like "Ideal" models.

[zoogirl]

You want to see the Pal?
I thought you'd never ask!
Here she is. The handle is wooden and the red layers look like the same material as in the other knife. There are no markings on the other side of the tang.
I do appreciate the help!

[doglegg]

Zoogirl, you have a couple of knice old fixed blades. You have a good eye.

[Gunsil]

Dunno who made the Pal Brand but it looks like a late one for that company and it also looks european as most Pal Brand knives were. I think the W&B is likely the older of the two. Thanks for showing them.

[orvet]

You definitely have good taste in old fixed blades!
to AAPK!

[zoogirl]

Why, thank you all very much! I'm told I have a good eye for old items in general. I buy stuff if it screams at me, as these two did.
I'd been looking for a hunting/sheath knife for quite a while when the Pal jumped up at me. I was actually looking for a stacked handle but as soon as I picked it up, it was just right, you know?
I've always carried some kind of knife on me and been fascinated by them. I'm a collector by nature and my love of old things has led to a growing stash of vintage knives. Now it's time to learn about them. I go more for how the knife looks and feels than value and condition. Matter of fact, just bought an old Metropolis blade in a very roughly carved wooden handle for $3 because I liked the idea that someone needed a knife and had the ingenuity to put together something crude but serviceable. So, don't expect treasure from me but you might see some strange and interesting stuff!
Thanks for the welcome!

[zoogirl]

Dunno who made the Pal Brand but it looks like a late one for that company and it also looks european as most Pal Brand knives were. I think the W&B is likely the older of the two. Thanks for showing them.

From what I've read, Pal Brand was a Utica Knife and Razor brand. It became Pal Blade out of the old Remington factory in '35, so it's no later than that.

[Gunsil]

Remington sold their cutlery division to Pal Cutlery in 1940. Pal Cutlery did not take over Remington's factory.

[Gunsil]

Remington sold their cutlery division to Pal in 1940. Pal did not take over Remington's factory. They moved the equipment to their own facility in MA.