northfield genuine stag melon whittler - a review

[bloomingeek]

Now that is one fine knife!

[smallmouth]

It really is.

I'm disappointed in myself I gave in and ordered one in the burnt stag. But I'm sure once I receive it I'll be happy again.

[mito0]

thanks, bloomingeek.

smallmouth, i'll bet you'll enjoy it.
i went ahead and ordered one of the un-serialized burnt stags myself.
the genuine stag version is headed to the "sell" pile.
i think i'll be much happier with one that cost $50 less than this one.

[Aimus Moses]

As for 1095 as an inexpensive steel, I disagree with you on that point entirely. While the physical steel itself is inexpensive, the tooling and experience required to work with it at the production level is not. 1095 is not suited to fine blanking, as it's high carbon content causes excessive die wear. This increases the number of grinding and finishing steps required to complete the finished blade. It requires a more controlled and precise heating and tempering cycle to reduce the chances of blade warping or cracking, and bad tempering can leave the blades to hard or to soft to function correctly. This is why you have not seen 1095 steel in mass production knives since Schrade went out of business. If GEC wanted to be cheap, and really wanted to make an inexpensive knife, they could do so easily with the use of 420 series stainless steels. I hope this never happens. ever.

This got me to thinking, if carbon steel costs more to produce and is harder to work with, why does Case offer carbon or CV steel in their lower end priced knives like the yellow composite handled knives? One would think if the carbon or CV blade steel cost more than their standard 420 SS, and it's harder to work with, the price of the carbon or CV steel bladed knife would be higher. And Case would surely use the higher costing better grade steel like carbon or CV on their mammoth ivory, stag, and pearl handled and other exotic higher end priced knives instead of using the cheaper, easier to work with standard 420 SS, wouldn't they?

Aimus

[tjmurphy]

MAN!! That is one SLEEK knife. I like it.

[mito0]

This got me to thinking, if carbon steel costs more to produce and is harder to work with, why does Case offer carbon or CV steel in their lower end priced knives like the yellow composite handled knives? One would think if the carbon or CV blade steel cost more than their standard 420 SS, and it's harder to work with, the price of the carbon or CV steel bladed knife would be higher. And Case would surely use the higher costing better grade steel like carbon or CV on their mammoth ivory, stag, and pearl handled and other exotic higher end priced knives instead of using the cheaper, easier to work with standard 420 SS, wouldn't they?

Aimus

i have to say, i don't believe carbon steel is substantially more expensive on the production line than any other steel.
i just think it's fallen out of favor with collectors who never learned how to care for it.
there's a knife store where i live that i like to visit and shoot the breeze.
the OWNER of the store was complaining about carbon steel's propensity to rust.
when i told him to put a light coat of oil on the blade, he looked at me like i was speaking in tongues.
it's amazing how such basic knowledge gets forgotten, even by people who are supposed to be experts.
i'm not a huge fan of 420 steel, but it's popularity among knife companies is understandable.
it's inexpensive, it's well suited for blanking, and it polishes up very nicely.
i'm not sure anyone knows what sort of steel case's CV is - only that it's a carbon steel with chrome and vanadium - so it's hard to say how it stacks up against 420 in those regards.
however, as was pointed out earlier, most of case's high end knives are bought by collectors, not users.
i think most collectors don't want to worry about their blades rusting due to improper care or storage.
people who use their knives every day at work tend to buy cheaper knives because they go through them so quickly.
those people know the benefits of carbon steel, and they know how to care for it.
i think that's why companies like case and queen (with their new 1095 queen city line) make inexpensive knives with carbon steel blades.
personally, i consider 1095 to be among the very best steels for daily use, but it does require a certain level of knowledge and responsibility to keep it looking good.

[Hukk]

Case's CV is essentially 1095 with a bit of Vanadium and Chrome and there are other various carbon steels that are similar to 1095. Many prefer CV over 1095.
I don't like 420 SS either except to use it for bolsters but annealed 410 SS seems to work better for me for both bolsters and pins (must be annealed otherwise it will be too hard to work).

Not all 420 SS is created equal. Straight 420 SS (0.15% Carbon) will only harden to about 50HRC while the 420 SS HC (High Carbon) (about 0.45% Carbon) will harden to about 55HRC which is more suitable for blades and is often used for blades.

I like carbon steel the best but there are times where stainless is the better choice for me - especially while I'm at or on the ocean.

[Aimus Moses]

I totally agree mito. It's surprising at how many younger people don't know the difference in carbon and stainless steels. Most only know there's one kind of blade steel that will rust easier. And like you said they have no ideal how to care for it. When the shiny wears off it loses it's appeal to them. I don't know the differences in costs involved with making carbon or CV steel bladed knives -vs- stainless steel. I was just going by what Adam posted. I know Adam and Hukk are both pretty knowledgeable about blade steels and I don't honestly know the price differences so I can't say Adam's statement is wrong. I just began thinking what I posted after reading Adam's reply about carbon steel costing more and being harder to work with when using it for blades. Usually when something costs more and the production part of it is more time consuming, it raises the price of the product. So I wondered why Case would use a more costly and more time consuming steel in their lower price line of knives. One would think that cutlery companies would use the better, more costly steel on their highest price line of knives, that would fit in line with a company saying that their top of the line models have the best and most expensive materials used to make them. If that wasn't the case it would be like GM saying here is our top of the line Corvette. It has the most expensive and best parts material available used in making it but, it has a Chevette 4 cylinder engine in it. That just wouldn't make sense. I mean it would for someone that wants good gas mileage but not to someone that wanted the complete top of the line package. I know the collector equation comes into play here about knives, and they won't be used, only looked at. But if a company is going to call one of their products TOP OF THE LINE, shouldn't it really fit that definition for both use and collecting? I just don't understand building a knife with top quality pins, liners, bolsters, shields, and real expensive handle material and have a lesser quality, cheaper blade steel used on it. To me, that's not collecting the best example of any company's knife. Hukk, what is your opinion on carbon or CV steel costing more and being more time consuming to make into blades than stainless steel?

Aimus

[Hukk]

Hukk, what is your opinion on carbon or CV steel costing more and being more time consuming to make into blades than stainless steel?
Aimus

I don't know how much Case pays for it's CV carbon steel or how much Case pays for it's stainless, a 420 variant if I remember correctly. I pay less for carbon steel - much less. BUT, I think that 420 SS (High Carbon) steel would be cheaper to work with than say 440C. 420 SS HC has about 11.5% to 14% chromium with 0.45% Carbon compared to 440C having 16% to 18% chromium with up to 1.2% Carbon. During heat treatment Chromium Carbides are formed in stainless steels (for these two) and they provide the hardness and toughness in the corresponding steels. 440C will be harder on equipment used to make knives than 420 SS HC. In this case 420 SS HC is much cheaper to process into blades and Case orders so much of it (or another 420 Variant - Tru Sharp?) that they almost set the price (not quite). 420 SS HC is available in large rolls and sheets that allows for making large quantities of blades cheaply using heavy stamping presses. Stainless can also be air quenched rather than using oil and sometimes a cryogenic quench during tempering. (heat must always be last when tempering).

The carbon steel will use an oil quench usually and sometimes a cryogenic quench during tempering. Also Carbon steel may be cheaper to buy than Stainless but I don't know what forms it comes in for a factory order. Strip steel would be very expensive to use compared to sheets or rolls. In CV, Vanadium Carbides are much tougher than Chromium Carbides.

I know I've read it somewhere and think I've written that Carbon Steel is more expensive than stainless BUT - I'm thinking, NOW, that perhaps only when compared to the 420 SS HC or similar steels. So, I'm leaning to Carbon Steel being the less expensive to manufacture than stainless. Certainly it's true for me that it's cheaper to use Carbon Steel and I think it's true for Case as well - now. There are other cost factors I don't know such as scrap rates and so forth.

[gmusic]

I totally agree mito. It's surprising at how many younger people don't know the difference in carbon and stainless steels. Most only know there's one kind of blade steel that will rust easier. Aimus

I gave a nice GEC to my nephew when he lived up in Oregon; he was around 13 at the time. I told him to keep it clean and dry. I asked him sometime later how he liked the knife; "it turned all sorts of funny colors" he said. I was stunned. Youth..................it's wasted on the young.

[smallmouth]

My Executive Whittler arrived today. The smaller blades are pretty tiny, but overall it's a slick knife. Everything fits just so. I'm really happy with it.

It seems like they should have stamped 893309 instead of 892309.

[tjmurphy]

Smallmouth, I just ordered one of those tonight. In order to save a buck or two, I got the burnt stag EDC from CollectorKnives.Net Hope to get it Tuesday or Wednesday. The EDC means that there is a slight blemish on it somewhere. Man, those Wharncliff blades just blow me away, and these are sooooooo sleek.

[bloomingeek]

Yep, I'm in too. I just ordered the EDC burnt stag Whittler from CollectorKnives.Net. As fast as the stag ones go, I figured I better get one now.

[tjmurphy]

Yep, I'm in too. I just ordered the EDC burnt stag Whittler from CollectorKnives.Net. As fast as the stag ones go, I figured I better get one now.

Got my knife today. Did you get yours? Could you find a flaw? I'm not that skilled at inspecting knives, but I can't find what's wrong with it.

[mito0]

Got my knife today. Did you get yours? Could you find a flaw? I'm not that skilled at inspecting knives, but I can't find what's wrong with it.

you definitely got a hell of a deal, then!

i got a non-serialized burnt stag, and i'm much happier with it than i was with the genuine stag version.
a note of caution, though - the very tip of my master blade broke off (only about 1/32").
it was an easy fix, though - i just filed down the nose of the knife to make a new point.
i think this one will be my new edc for a long, long time.

[tjmurphy]

Got my knife today. Did you get yours? Could you find a flaw? I'm not that skilled at inspecting knives, but I can't find what's wrong with it.

you definitely got a hell of a deal, then!

i got a non-serialized burnt stag, and i'm much happier with it than i was with the genuine stag version.
a note of caution, though - the very tip of my master blade broke off (only about 1/32").it was an easy fix, though - i just filed down the nose of the knife to make a new point.
i think this one will be my new edc for a long, long time.

I took a look at mine and there is a burr on the very tip. Reckon how prone it will be to breaking like yours??

[mito0]

I took a look at mine and there is a burr on the very tip. Reckon how prone it will be to breaking like yours??

i think mine got smacked on the spring divider when it snapped shut, and chipped off the very tip.
tough to say how susceptible other knives will be - it's possible my blade was ground just a tad bit too long to begin with.
i'll compare it to my others and see if that's the case.
the good news is that, after filing a new point on the blade, i haven't had any more issues with it.
this one's definitely a keeper for me.

[bloomingeek]

Got my knife today. Did you get yours? Could you find a flaw? I'm not that skilled at inspecting knives, but I can't find what's wrong with it.

Hey tjmurphy, I got mine yesterday and no, I can't find a flaw either. It's a really beautiful knife and I'd like to thank Collectorknives.net again. He has a really class knife business!