GEC blade snap.

GEC specializes in highly collectable and premium quality usable pocket knives. The company's USA manufactured knives have quickly proven to be a big hit with both collectors and users who seek quality American craftsmanship.
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saltwaterebel
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GEC blade snap.

Post by saltwaterebel »

Has anyone else noticed that the snap on the main blades have been a little weak? Going back over the last 2 or 3 years It seems the last 5 or so I have bought are just plain weak on the snap. The 29 I just bought for example. The main is weak. Color me disappointed.
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cody6268
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Re: GEC blade snap.

Post by cody6268 »

saltwaterebel wrote:Has anyone else noticed that the snap on the main blades have been a little weak? Going back over the last 2 or 3 years It seems the last 5 or so I have bought are just plain weak on the snap. The 29 I just bought for example. The main is weak. Color me disappointed.
I guess they changed it because of the amount of people who viewed it as too strong; and from what I'm seeing, it's quite a few. I like a strong spring; reduces the chance of a blade closing on my finger; while reducing the need for a lock.
Modern Slip Joints
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Re: GEC blade snap.

Post by Modern Slip Joints »

Since I love stag, pearl and jibbed bone I hate to write this but, for slip joints, as the price of the product line increases the likelihood of getting a knife with poor snap worsens. Great snap is most reliably found in Victorinox and Wenger Swiss Army Knives, Camillus knives from the old U.S. factory and U.S. made Bucks. I do not own enough Schrades or Bear MGCs/Bear & Sons knives to want to generalize about them. That has been my experience. I wish that it were not so.

More often than not members writing about GECs are writing about knives that have been scarcely used if at all. Some times new knives do not have good snap into the open position because their bolsters were pressed slightly to close together or there is a tiny amount of polishing powder between the blade and a bolster. Opening some of those a few hundred to a thousand times oiling the joint every 25 to 50 openings gives them good snap.
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Dinadan
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Re: GEC blade snap.

Post by Dinadan »

Modern Slip Joints wrote: More often than not members writing about GECs are writing about knives that have been scarcely used if at all. Some times new knives do not have good snap into the open position because their bolsters were pressed slightly to close together or there is a tiny amount of polishing powder between the blade and a bolster. Opening some of those a few hundred to a thousand times oiling the joint every 25 to 50 openings gives them good snap.
I three GECs, not enough for a good sampling, and the newest is about three years old. The oldest has such a strong snap that I would describe it as not usable. The newer couple are plenty strong but not too strong.

Some folks, including me, might question why they need to spend time and effort making a brand new knife usable. Especially one for which they paid over a hundred dollars!

I have had the same issue with at least one Case, so it is not just GEC.

Just like pistols: if a cheap pistol does not work right that is because it is a POS. If an expensive pistol does not work right, then you need to break it in.
Mel
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XX Case XX
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Re: GEC blade snap.

Post by XX Case XX »

I must be lucky. All the GEC's I've bought over the last 4-5 years have blade snap that is, in my opinion, nearly perfect. Not too hard, not too soft. In other words, not a "nail breaker", but not too soft that it takes no effort to open it. I'd call it "moderate" snap.

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kootenay joe
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Re: GEC blade snap.

Post by kootenay joe »

If you look down into the 'well' at the inside surface of a backspring you can see a high spot in about the middle where the spring pivot pin is. Then as you look along the spring towards the blade end you can see that the spring has a long dip or trough where it has been thinned out. I think the amount it has been thinned out determines strength of the spring.
I hope one or more of the knife makers here will comment on this observation. I am not certain that my conclusion about spring strength is correct.
kj
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Greenman
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Re: GEC blade snap.

Post by Greenman »

kootenay joe wrote:If you look down into the 'well' at the inside surface of a backspring you can see a high spot in about the middle where the spring pivot pin is. Then as you look along the spring towards the blade end you can see that the spring has a long dip or trough where it has been thinned out. I think the amount it has been thinned out determines strength of the spring.
I hope one or more of the knife makers here will comment on this observation. I am not certain that my conclusion about spring strength is correct.
kj
Thinning a knife’s backspring during the final hafting/finishing processes will also weaken the spring. Approximately two years ago, I purchased a green linen Micarta 473216 GEC Farm & Field two-blade Hayn’ Helper with an improperly expanded centre pin. After the blades were opened and closed a few times, the centre pin would rotate about 180°. Because of the radius of the Micarta handle slabs, this rotation left an uncomfortably sharp edge on the then protruding bottom edge of the pin. I had to send the knife to GEC three different times before they properly corrected this manufacturing defect. Each time that the knife was sent to them, the mechanics at GEC apparently re-peened the centre pin and then re-hafted the knife. To begin with, the knife had a pull of about 6 on the main sheepsfoot blade and a pull of about 4 on the secondary pen blade—just about ideal, in my opinion. By the time GEC finished fiddling with the knife, the primary blade pull had been reduced to a 4 and the secondary blade pull was at best a 2. Needless to say, I was most unhappy! :x
Josh

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kootenay joe
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Re: GEC blade snap.

Post by kootenay joe »

I was asking about this thinning of the spring because i think this might be how spring tension is tuned. If so then thinning a slight amount too much = weak spring, or not enough thinning = nail breaker spring. This would explain why all knives in the same run do not have identical spring tension.
I wonder why your knife lost spring tension from replacing the spring pivot pin ? Was the spring also replaced ?
kj
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Greenman
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Re: GEC blade snap.

Post by Greenman »

kootenay joe wrote:I was asking about this thinning of the spring because i think this might be how spring tension is tuned. If so then thinning a slight amount too much = weak spring, or not enough thinning = nail breaker spring. This would explain why all knives in the same run do not have identical spring tension.
I wonder why your knife lost spring tension from replacing the spring pivot pin ? Was the spring also replaced ?
kj
The backsprings (there are two on this particular model) were not replaced—I don’t believe that GEC ever disassembled my knife during any of the three repair attempts. My best guess is that they merely re-peened the protruding portions of the centre pin and then reshaped (re-hafted) the entire handle of the knife in order to restore the smooth flow of its nicely curved shape. During this process, they would have had to sand and polish the exposed areas of the knife’s backsprings. While doing this, they would have inevitably removed a small amount of material from said backsprings, thus thinning—and thereby weakening—both springs. This entire process was repeated on three different occasions. My 47 is now noticeably slimmer and has a somewhat wasp-waisted appearance when compared to other knives of the same model.

I used this story of my experience to illustrate one possible reason why all knives in the same run do not have identical spring tension. Each knife is individually hafted. The hafting process is labour intensive—each knife is shaped and polished by a worker using subsequently finer abrasive belts on a stationary belt sander. If that employee uses slightly more hand pressure or holds the knife to the abrasive surface for a slightly longer time while sanding the knife’s backsprings, that knife is going to have thinner and weaker backsprings.

I do not know if GEC ever individually “tunes” their knives before the hafting process by removing material from the interior surface of each backspring. My guess is that this would be extremely time consuming for a factory operation as it would involve repeatedly disassembling and reassembling each knife.
Josh

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“Man is the most insane species. He worships an invisible god and destroys a visible nature, unaware that this nature he's destroying is this god he's worshipping.”
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Greenman
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Re: GEC blade snap.

Post by Greenman »

Greenman wrote:
kootenay joe wrote:I was asking about this thinning of the spring because i think this might be how spring tension is tuned. If so then thinning a slight amount too much = weak spring, or not enough thinning = nail breaker spring. This would explain why all knives in the same run do not have identical spring tension.
I wonder why your knife lost spring tension from replacing the spring pivot pin ? Was the spring also replaced ?
kj
The backsprings (there are two on this particular model) were not replaced—I don’t believe that GEC ever disassembled my knife during any of the three repair attempts. My best guess is that they merely re-peened the protruding portions of the centre pin and then reshaped (re-hafted) the entire handle of the knife in order to restore the smooth flow of its nicely curved shape. During this process, they would have had to sand and polish the exposed areas of the knife’s backsprings. While doing this, they would have inevitably removed a small amount of material from said backsprings, thus thinning—and thereby weakening—both springs. This entire process was repeated on three different occasions. My 47 is now noticeably slimmer and has a somewhat wasp-waisted appearance when compared to other knives of the same model.

I used this story of my experience to illustrate one possible reason why all knives in the same run do not have identical spring tension. Each knife is individually hafted. The hafting process is labour intensive—each knife is shaped and polished by a worker using subsequently finer abrasive belts on a stationary belt sander. If that employee uses slightly more hand pressure or holds the knife to the abrasive surface for a slightly longer time while sanding the knife’s backsprings, that knife is going to have thinner and weaker backsprings.

I do not know if GEC ever individually “tunes” their knives before the hafting process by removing material from the interior surface of each backspring. My guess is that this would be extremely time consuming for a factory operation as it would involve repeatedly disassembling and reassembling each knife.
Here are three YouTube videos which might help to further illustrate my point by explaining GEC’s manufacturing process. If memory serves, the hafting operation is shown at the very end of Part 2 and is continued in the beginning of Part 3.

[For some unknown reason, I am unable to properly embed these YouTube videos. The procedure outlined in this AAPK post
viewtopic.php?f=98&t=48256&p=564746&hil ... be#p564746
Is not working for me. If you wish to view these videos, simply click the provided links.]

Great Eastern Cutlery Factory Tour Part 1
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ZeHWa5jyO74


Great Eastern Cutlery Factory Tour Part 2
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=xA-OpahW7EA


Great Eastern Cutlery Factory Tour Part 3
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=yPzgOs6JEyg
Josh

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“Man is the most insane species. He worships an invisible god and destroys a visible nature, unaware that this nature he's destroying is this god he's worshipping.”
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jerryd6818
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Re: GEC blade snap.

Post by jerryd6818 »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZeHWa5jyO74&app=desktop

Remove the & sign and everything that follows it.


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Greenman
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Re: GEC blade snap.

Post by Greenman »

jerryd6818 wrote:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZeHWa5jyO74&app=desktop

Remove the & sign and everything that follows it.


What ampersand (& sign), Jerry?
You can see the links in my post exactly as I posted them.
The only difference that I can see is that I was posting from a mobile platform (iOS), while you appear to be using a desktop.
Go figure. ::shrug::

Edit:
I reckon I answered my own question. It seems that all I had to do was to change the mobile link to a desktop link (“m” to “www”). Forty-two years of computer experience and degrees in both electrical engineering and computer science and It took me several hours and a dozen or more tries to figure that out… :oops:
Oh well, thanks for pointing me in the right direction, Jerry! ::handshake::
Josh

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“Man is the most insane species. He worships an invisible god and destroys a visible nature, unaware that this nature he's destroying is this god he's worshipping.”
— Hubert Reeves
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Re: GEC blade snap.

Post by Onearmbladejunkie »

I have one arm. I own 43 wonderful GEC knives. They all work well for me. There is no such thing as a perfect knife.
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jerryd6818
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Re: GEC blade snap.

Post by jerryd6818 »

Greenman wrote:Forty-two years of computer experience and degrees in both electrical engineering and computer science and It took me several hours and a dozen or more tries to figure that out… :oops:
Oh well, thanks for pointing me in the right direction, Jerry! ::handshake::
And I'll bet you think you're the only one. If I had a nickel for every time................. ::dang::

I'm just a hardware guy. My only degree is 98.6º
Forged on the anvil of discipline.
The Few. The Proud.
Jerry D.

This country has become more about sub-groups than about it's unity as a nation.

"The #72 pattern has got to be pretty close to the perfect knife."
--T.J. Murphy 2012
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Re: GEC blade snap.

Post by Onearmbladejunkie »

I hear the #86 Oil Field jack knives have a 6 pull or a little more. I might have to use my feet and a CASE XX blade pick to open my gator snap knives. I am so excited to play with my first #86 Oil Field Jack knife tomorrow.
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