Ulster Old Timers

[kootenay joe]

I have 2 Ulster knives branded with the name "Old Timer"; 3 3/8", 2 blade Barlow marked: "Ulster/U.S.A./10 OT" and a 3 3/8" Jr. Stockman, a 58 OT. Note the example i am showing here is a "John Primble/Belknap Inc/U.S.A." with "934" on the back tang.
I cannot find an example with the Ulster 58 OT markings but the Primble is the same knife.
Does anyone know when Ulster first used the name "Old Timer" ?
I think it was before Schrade-Walden launched the "Old Timer" line of knives in 1958, but i have not seen any proof of this. Note the 2 knives i am showing here are not necessarily early examples.
kj

[Shearer]

Google this.
Researching the Ulster Prince Albert knives
Larry Vickery 12/2006

Grant

[kootenay joe]

Thanks Grant. In the 2006 article Mr. Vickery writes:
"The Old Timer line started by Schrade-Walden in 1959 with a bone handled, Barlow
styled knife, tang stamped, 2OT with OLD TIMER stamped across the bottom bolster. Early in
1960 the bone handled 8OT was added to the line. Later that year the ULSTER 58OT was made
available followed in 1961 year by the ULSTER 50OT. In 1962 Schrade added the 108OT and
ULSTER added both the 10OT and the 12OT. Both the 50OT and 12OT were only available for
1 or 2 years."
and: " No other Ulster OT’s were added, except for the special 114OT in 1968"

I know that more of the Schrade and Ulster histories has become known since 2006 so is the above timeline still considered correct ?
He does not say if the early 58OT's (1961 & on) had bone or Delrin handles.
I have seen bone Ulster Old Timer 58OT's and it is these that i am thinking might be older than what Mr. Vickery said in 2006.
kj

[Shearer]

The early 580T and 500T had bone handles like the first 80T's.
I would say they all where made around the same time.

Grant

[orvet]

Roland, as far as I am aware Larry’s dates are about as accurate as we have at this point in time.
The Ulster 50OT and Ulster 12OT are probably more rare than the 2OT, based strictly on my observation.
I had a 50OT and Larry Vickery has one also. Those are the only two that I know of for certain although I suspect Rich Langston probably has one or more, as well as some of the fellows in the Walden area.
I have a number of Ulster #12 Barlows but I have not seen an Ulster 12OT. I have several 10OT’s they are not that difficult to find.
The camper model, the 114OT is a bit difficult to find but they can be located, however I think they are usually not stamped with the model number.

Hope this helps a little.

[orvet]

The early 580T and 500T had bone handles like the first 80T's.
I would say they all where made around the same time.

Grant

Grant, on Larry Vickery's site he has the Ulster catalogs posted.
The Ulster 50OT and the Ulster 58OTare both listed in the 1960 and the 1961 catalog pages.


EDIT:
Schrade dated their catalog pages with the year being part of the page number.
Ulster did not use the date as part of their catalog page numbering system and consequently it is easy for a page to be listed under multiple years. Even when I was in the cutlery business in the 1980s it was common to use a promotional flyer for more than one year especially when it was a flyer about a single knife.

I think the flyers on the Ulster 50OT and 58OT were mistakenly listed as being from 1960. I do believe they were issued until 1961 and that the Ulster 50OT and 58OT postdate the original Schrade Walden 2OT and 8OT.

[Shearer]

The early 580T and 500T had bone handles like the first 80T's.
I would say they all where made around the same time.

Grant

Grant, on Larry Vickery's site he has the Ulster catalogs posted.
The Ulster 50OT and the Ulster 58OTare both listed in the 1960 and the 1961 catalog pages.

Dale I down load the catalogs a few years ago.
I also have a 500T and I would have to agree with you they are rare.I have only seen one on Ebay in 5 years.


Grant

[kootenay joe]

Dale & Grant, thanks so much for presenting the early "Old Timer" information so well.
I now know that Schrade-Walden was the originator of "Old Timer" knives and that the few Ulsters with Old Timer branding first appeared about a year after the first S-W. Old Timers.
Now: off to find a bone 58OT & a bone 10OT.
kj

[1fartsmella]

I'm not sure how this fits into the Old Timer picture. This is an old KA-BAR - UNION CUT CO etched "OLD TIMER" TRAPPER'S KNIFE. Vintage 1923 to 1951

[kootenay joe]

Wow ! What a Beautiful "Old Timer" knife !
kj

[Chase]

1FS,

Nice old Kabar, however, it has absolutely nothing to do with the Schrade launch of their First Old Timer knives.

I have the documentation to prove that Schrade introduced the Schrade OLD TIMER in 1959 and that was with the Schrade Walden 2 OT. In 1960 they tried out the Schrade Walden 3 OT with some samples and it did not interest anyone. They then added the 8 OT in smooth bone and so on...

I hope this helps clarify the Schrade Old Timer timeline......

Tom

[orvet]

I concur Tom, on both the Kabar and on the dating of the early Old Timers.

[Edgewise]

I recently found out about the Ulster 58OT (thanks kj) but my research turned up two measurements, 2 3/4 " and 3 1/4 ".
Which is correct?
They don't seem very available, probably a short run or special order. Does any other more popular knife of the same size use the same pattern, especially that main blade?
I thought the 897uh was the knife to end all knives but maybe it needs a 58OT, or it's twin, to complete the picture?

[kootenay joe]

The Ulster 58OT is 3 1/4". Not a 'short run' at all. Ulster made a great many of these for about 20 ? years: 1961- ~ 1981. Note this is a guess. I don't know exactly when "Ulster 58OT" was last made.
Keep looking, they are 'out there', most in used condition; unused is a harder to find.
kj

[Meridian_Mike]

The 58 OT seems to be the the most common of the Ulster Old Timers. I have several and have seen several.

The 10 OT (Barlow) was the hardest for me to find.... I only have one of these.

Then the 114 OT was second.... I have 2 of those..... One without a bale.

My original bunch that I "posed" to resemble the label on the PA can....

Mike

[jxr1197]

The earliest Ulster Old Timers are among my favorite knives. The sparkly brown plastic 'meerschaum' handles were much better looking (IMO) than Delrin. In this group are an 8OT, a couple of 58OTs, a Primble 934 and my new pride and joy - a 50OT.

[Meridian_Mike]

Nice looking group of Old Timers!
I too, have a soft spot in my heart (and wallet) for the Old Timers.
Here is one of my 10 OT Ulsters....

And one of my 114 OT Ulsters.....

I made myself a picture of my Ulsters with the Prince Albert offer can.....

Mike

[Meridian_Mike]

Well dog gone it.... I guess if I was paying just a small amount of attention, I would have seen I posted those pics ONE BOX before my last post in this thread.
Sorry y'all.... I am proud of my Old Timers but I need to learn to read...... so I can avoid looking STUPID.

[jxr1197]

Here's an early 58 in bone. It needs a little TLC but this is one of those knives so rare that the mere fact it exists is cause for excitement (for me anyway, lol.)

[Meridian_Mike]

Ah..... Now I see who bid against me Jason.....LOL.
Yep, I had my eye on that one. Well, glad you got it.
Congrats on the new addition to your collection.

SO, it is a 58 OT? I never could find a tang mark I could read.
(I was thinking 50 OT at first.)

Mike

[jxr1197]

Ah..... Now I see who bid against me Jason.....LOL.
Yep, I had my eye on that one. Well, glad you got it.
Congrats on the new addition to your collection.

SO, it is a 58 OT? I never could find a tang mark I could read.
(I was thinking 50 OT at first.)

Mike

I sniped ya good on that one! You had good instincts on it - I was surprised (but happy) that there was only 2 of us bidding. On the early 50 and 58's the pattern number is on the back of the tang. By the time the 58 was dressed in Delrin the tang stamp changed and the number was brought to the front. The 50 is a 2 blade jack in the same frame. It's got a turkish clip behind a pen blade. I still have never seen a 50 in Delrin. I'm convinced they only made a few in bone and the sparkly brown plastic stuff.

[Meridian_Mike]

I sniped ya good on that one! You had good instincts on it - I was surprised (but happy) that there was only 2 of us bidding. On the early 50 and 58's the pattern number is on the back of the tang. By the time the 58 was dressed in Delrin the tang stamp changed and the number was brought to the front. The 50 is a 2 blade jack in the same frame. It's got a turkish clip behind a pen blade. I still have never seen a 50 in Delrin. I'm convinced they only made a few in bone and the sparkly brown plastic stuff.

LOL.... good snipe on this ole guy.
Thanks for the history lesson concerning the early OTs! I didn't think about the fact that the early ones had the number stamped on the back of the tang....COOL.

The search goes on!

Mike