Case 62098F ??

[Twatts]

New to the site and would appreciate any information on this Case fishermans knife. I believe it’s a 62098F pattern but would like to know more and the estimated year of manufacture. I believe to be in the 40’s. It has the Case’s Stainless on the master blade and that’s all beside the shield. Really nice shape but minor pitting on the fishing blade. Appraisal value?

[rugmar]

This knife appears to me to have a tested era shield which I think would place it before 1940 and after 1920. Don't have much more to offer except it's really pretty. There have been some fakes of this pattern shown recently but I'm not suggesting your is fake. Just you need the experts to weigh in on this one.

[Twatts]

Thank you. My brother works at a pawn shop and this one came in with several other old case knives that were the persons grandpas and had been in a drawer for years. They needed some money and pawned them. I would never part with my grandpas knife for anything!

[Twatts]

Here’s some more pictures.

[RalphAlsip]

I believe it’s a 62098F pattern but would like to know more and the estimated year of manufacture.

Welcome to AAPK and thank you for posting clear pictures with your question. I agree that pattern number is an authentic 62098F and agree the time of manufacture is between 1920 and 1940. The marking "Case's Stainless" was used instead of "Case Tested XX" for this example. It is a beautiful knife.

[zp4ja]

That stamp predates Tested ERA I believe. Not near my books so possible I am wrong. I believe 1915' or 16' to 1920' as I recall from memory. Not a widely used stamp.
Knife has been cleaned in my opinion which affects value to some buyers. On my phone so hard to look closer at pics but sure looks like old CASE Green one to me.

[zp4ja]

CASE LIBRARY shows 1916' to 1920'. Think I have only ever ever observed on the 98F. I have a SEA BEAST 32098F (edited model number error just now) with same stamp.

https://www.casexx.com/Library/TangStamp.asp

Also listed in Gerald Witcher's book as I recall with same time frame.

Jerry

[zp4ja]

Here is my Sea Beast example here on AAPK. Not mint but pretty scarce knife.

https://www.allaboutpocketknives.com/kn ... =Sea+beast

Jerry

[Doc B]

Gorgeous bone on that! Welcome to AAPK

[Gunsil]

One more time. It is NOT possible for that mark to be 1915-1920. Stainless steel was not even known to man in 1915 or 1916 and did not become commercially available for cutlery use until after WW1 which ended in 1919. The mark and the knife are tested era knives. So is the Sea Beast.
'Nuff said.

[rugmar]

Before I say anything else I want all here to know that I only want to learn about this hobby. Now, can someone tell me why the research section on this site does list a "Case's Stainless" stamp as 1916-1920? Initially, I would have believed as Gunsil does, that stainless was not widely available at that time or maybe not at all. So what's the true story.

As for the originally posted knife, the more I look the more I like!

[Gunsil]

The OP knife is a gorgeous knife without a doubt. There is a problem with many date/tang stamp charts. If you look at enough of them you will see the Case's Stainless mark shown here as much later, in the late 1930s which is more likely correct since the invention and availability of stainless steel is factually dateable. The KA-BAR stamp chart shown on this and other sites has so many errors as to render it almost irrelevant. Even the Case Tested mark which is listed as 1920-1940 has been proven incorrect, it was definitely used during WW2 and probably for a couple more years. There is also no proof it began in 1920. The problem arises from the fact that none of these old knife companies made knives for the purpose of our collecting them many years later. They did not keep any records of when they changed stamps or marks and much of what we have came from the memories of old employees whose memories seem to have not really served them all that well.

[Mumbleypeg]

The Research section here is good but not infallible. I have found several mistakes in it. For that matter it should be noted that I know of no infallible sources. The dates given here for that “Case’s Stainless” stamp are found in several well-regarded reference books. Others, equally well-regarded, list the dates of its use as being much later. As Gene (Gunsil) has pointed out, stainless steel wasn’t in use for cutlery until later than 1920 so its pre-1920 use is highly doubtful.

Pocket knife collecting as a hobby was pretty much non-existent prior to the late 1960’s. Reference books were rare. As the hobby began to take shape so began a need for reference materials (there was a market for such materials where none existed previously). Collectors and authors began researching information to put into reference books. Prior to collectors, pretty much no one cared when various stampings were used and few if any records existed, regardless what company made the knife. Knives were tools, plain and simple.

One story, published in Sargent’s 7th edition, says that in the early 1970’s in response to an inquiry, Case’s VP Bob Farquharson asked long-time Case employee Mary Petro for her memory of when various Case tang stampings were used. Mary came up with some dates, and those dates were given to researchers and subsequently published as being “gospel”. Those dates Mary provided were approximations and in retrospect evidence shows some were off by several years. I don’t know if the “Case’s Stainless” dates originated with Mary Petro or another source.

Most of the time our best source for information about when various patterns were made, when stamps were used, and when features were introduced are old catalogs. Those are difficult to find and in some cases non-existent. The earliest W.R. Case Company catalog I’m personally aware of is from 1936.

Hope this helps - probably more than you wanted to know.

Ken

[Gunsil]

Dang good dissertation Ken!! I started collecting a a child I suppose. My earliest pocket knives were given to me used by my uncles and they were pre-WW2 knives. I liked knives and family friends would sometimes bring me one. By the time I was 14 (1961) I had 14 bayonets, 14 swords, and several handsful of pocket knives and maybe ten hunting knives. My collecting bloomed as a teenager and I combed antique shops for them. I did not care what date they were made on as long as they were old. To this day I don't really understand why so many collectors have a need to know exactly when a knife was made. I think this all got crazy when Case, realizing there was a big market with collectors, began putting actual date codes on their knives so they could be IDed exactly to their year of manufacture. This was 1970 which coincides with Ken's idea of the onset of knife collecting. I am happy knowing my NYK knives got the Hammer Brand circa 1880s, could care less about knowing their exact dates of manufacture. Ditto on most antique knives, there just is no positive way of dating them. The Case guys seem to have it the worst, probably because Case began dating knives as a marketing ploy and that is all it is. All reference books have mistakes, new info in the way of old price lists and catalogs continuously come to new light and sometimes refute what was previously thought to be true. One instance is the nice Valley Forge trapper I got recently. Levine's says without the VF in a circle stamp the knives were only made between 1892 and 1899. Goins' says the VF in circle stamp began in 1916. Who is correct? My example has no VF and I don't really care if it is pre 1900 or pre-1916, it is a COOL OLD KNIFE. KA-BAR changed their stamps several times between 1923 and 1951 yet there are no old records at their factory to tell us exactly when these changes occurred, many KA-BAR collectors just sort or collect by pre-1952 or post 1951 and are happy with those dates. We need the old time machine, there is no other way to get these exact dates that drive folks crazy.

[Robo]

How about the fact that there is no pattern number on the back of the tang? Wouldn't that indicate that it's from the "Tested XX Era" Or the Tested XX Era as I used to know it (1920-1940) before I read Ken's post.

Ken--sorry--Gene: Wouldn't it be safe to say that despite eras not being as cut and dried as was once supposed there WILL be a point--for instance-- where The Tested XX stamp will be in full use in the entire line? and wouldn't that be no more than say six months to a year into the era? For instance: The new tooling/die for the Tested XX stamp hits the factory in mid 1919 and for whatever reason it starts getting used on some patterns where the old stamps dies are worn out. Or in 1941 a batch of blades with the Tested XX markings are found on a bottom shelf somewhere and are put into the production line so as not to waste them. These type events shouldn't change the parameters of the era or throw the parameters of the era into doubt. I bring this up because it doesn't seem helpful to overstate those exceptions in such a way that leaves new collectors more confused than they already are. I'm 100% for being as accurate as possible when it comes to the history of pocket cutlery. But having general outlines of the various Eras seems necessary in order to be able to communicate with fellow collectors with out a bunch of qualifying statements and caveats. looking forward to your thoughts on this. --Robo

[Robo]

Most of the time our best source for information about when various patterns were made, when stamps were used, and when features were introduced are old catalogs. Those are difficult to find and in some cases non-existent. The earliest W.R. Case Company catalog I’m personally aware of is from 1936.

Hope this helps - probably more than you wanted to know.

Ken[/quote]


I don't see that Catologs are all that definitive either as Case seemed to use whatever pictures (plates?) that were still servicable despite the tang stamps. There's a bunch of "Tested XX" tang stamps on knives in catologs from the 60s. The Hardware Wholesale catologs will picture one knife and proceed to list four more below it--some made by completely different companies--I've come to find--that look nothing like the knife pictured except that they are of the same general pattern. But I'm not complaining, solving the mysteries are what it's all about to me. And I think there are a lot left to solve if we're willing to do the work.