Western Tang Stamps

In 1911, H. N. Platts, was able to draw on his extensive friendships and family connections in the cutlery world to start Western States Cutlery and Manufacturing of Boulder Colorado. At first only a jobbing business, by 1920 construction and machinery purchases were underway to begin manufacture of knives. Through name changes--to Western States Cutlery Co. in 1953, then Western Cutlery Co. in 1956--and moves first across town and later to Longmont Colorado, the company stayed under the leadership of the Platt family until 1984. In that year, the company was sold to Coleman, becoming Coleman-Western. Eventually purchased by Camillus in 1991, Western continued until Camillus expired in 2007.
trail
Posts: 1325
Joined: Wed Apr 29, 2009 1:14 am

Western Tang Stamps

Post by trail »

So, let's get this great new forum started. How about a thread to collect all the various Western tang stamps over the years? I'll start off with one from an R12 fixed blade. I think this knife is from the Camillus era.
Attachments
western_r12_tang_scaled.jpg
western_r12_tang_scaled.jpg (40.93 KiB) Viewed 36346 times
sextonknifeworks
Posts: 470
Joined: Sat Feb 21, 2009 2:34 am

Re: Western Tang Stamps

Post by sextonknifeworks »

Here is a pic I cropped down but you can still see. This is front and back of the latest barlow I picked up.
Attachments
dsc_0042 tang.jpg
dsc_0043 tang.jpg
User avatar
orvet
Gold Tier
Gold Tier
Posts: 19336
Joined: Tue May 16, 2006 6:23 am
Location: Willamette Valley, Oregon

Re: Western Tang Stamps

Post by orvet »

Here is a Western tang stamp guide I got somewhere.
It was probably originally published in Knife World.

I know it doesn’t have all their stamps, but it is a start.
Attachments
Western Tang Stamp guide.jpg
Dale
AAPK Administrator

Please visit my AAPK store: www.allaboutpocketknives.com/orvet

Job 13:15

"Buy more ammo!" - Johnnie Fain
“Evil is Powerless If The Good are Unafraid.” – Ronald Reagan
User avatar
jerryd6818
Gold Tier
Gold Tier
Posts: 39165
Joined: Sun Jan 04, 2009 5:23 am
Location: The middle of the top of a bastion of Liberalism.

Re: Western Tang Stamps

Post by jerryd6818 »

Well, dang. They left out the one from the 50s -- Western over Boulder Colo over USA
Forged on the anvil of discipline.
The Few. The Proud.
Jerry D.

This country has become more about sub-groups than about it's unity as a nation.

"The #72 pattern has got to be pretty close to the perfect knife."
--T.J. Murphy 2012
trail
Posts: 1325
Joined: Wed Apr 29, 2009 1:14 am

Re: Western Tang Stamps

Post by trail »

The first one is from a 442a and the second from a beat up old West-Cut 334.
Attachments
western_442_tang.jpg
west-cut_tang.jpg
trail
Posts: 1325
Joined: Wed Apr 29, 2009 1:14 am

Re: Western Tang Stamps

Post by trail »

Here are two of the three stamps on my Western stockman. The third stamp, on the reverse of the main blade is the model number, 657.
Attachments
western_657_tang_2.jpg
User avatar
stressmaster5000
Posts: 81
Joined: Mon Jul 10, 2006 6:55 pm
Location: North Texas
Contact:

Re: Western Tang Stamps

Post by stressmaster5000 »

Here are a few I have right now. I have some Westaco also but the stampings are light or worn and hard to get a good photo of. Not sure but I think the bottom "Bird" knife is Camillus made.
Attachments
Western Large Trapper 691
Western Large Trapper 691
Western Stockman W338 with serrated Sheepsfoot blade
Western Stockman W338 with serrated Sheepsfoot blade
Western Stockman W338 with serrated Sheepsfoot blade
Western Stockman W338 with serrated Sheepsfoot blade
Western Bird knife
Western Bird knife
User avatar
FRJ
Posts: 15173
Joined: Fri May 14, 2010 1:43 pm
Location: Ct.

Re: Western Tang Stamps

Post by FRJ »

Here's 5 of mine.
Attachments
058.JPG
061.JPG
062.JPG
064.JPG
065.JPG
Joe
User avatar
TripleF
Bronze Tier
Bronze Tier
Posts: 18499
Joined: Mon Feb 14, 2011 3:42 pm
Location: West Central FL
Contact:

Re: Western Tang Stamps

Post by TripleF »

Western 657
Attachments
western 657 usa knife 002.JPG
western 657 usa knife 004.JPG
western 657 usa knife 022.JPG
SCOTT
HOME OF THE BRAVE! (not the scarety cats)

Colonial Knife Company History ebook:
https://gumroad.com/l/ZLDb
User avatar
chautauqua
Posts: 250
Joined: Fri Apr 01, 2011 12:56 am

Re: Western Tang Stamps

Post by chautauqua »

hope you can see tang stamps as battery died after 1st pic,these knives are similar,but must have been from different years one has carbon blades and a bail the other has stainless,both have western states in an arch over boulder colo,these 2 are the only advertising knives ive ever seen from western bought them both at a lawn sale for a quarter for the pair
Attachments
81711 161.JPG
my avatar is what happened the last time someone tried to sell me a bogus knife
citydweller
Posts: 2
Joined: Thu May 02, 2013 12:37 am
Location: Lancaster, PA

Re: Western Tang Stamps

Post by citydweller »

Hey all, just picked up a 13" fixed blade Western this afternoon. Here is the tang mark. Can't seem to find or date it.

More photos at this Picasa web album. If anyone can date this I'm all ears.
2013-05-01 19.10.25.jpg
These are the times that try mens souls" - Thomas Paine
User avatar
tongueriver
Posts: 6834
Joined: Tue Sep 16, 2008 8:01 pm

Re: Western Tang Stamps

Post by tongueriver »

I believe that it is a World War Two blade and guard which has been re-handled.
User avatar
jerryd6818
Gold Tier
Gold Tier
Posts: 39165
Joined: Sun Jan 04, 2009 5:23 am
Location: The middle of the top of a bastion of Liberalism.

Re: Western Tang Stamps

Post by jerryd6818 »

jerryd6818 wrote:Well, dang. They left out the one from the 50s -- Western over Boulder Colo over USA
Why I didn't post a picture the first time, I don't know. It's on an L39 I was given in 1957.
My old Western L39 Tang Stamp.jpg

And I have one like the one Mike and Stressmaster showed. It's on a 901 Stainless Camper.
Western Camper - Tang Stamp.JPG
Forged on the anvil of discipline.
The Few. The Proud.
Jerry D.

This country has become more about sub-groups than about it's unity as a nation.

"The #72 pattern has got to be pretty close to the perfect knife."
--T.J. Murphy 2012
citydweller
Posts: 2
Joined: Thu May 02, 2013 12:37 am
Location: Lancaster, PA

Re: Western Tang Stamps

Post by citydweller »

tongueriver wrote:I believe that it is a World War Two blade and guard which has been re-handled.
A local knife dealer (uncle*ron on ebay) says the mark dates around 1934-1950, also confirmed the rehandle.
These are the times that try mens souls" - Thomas Paine
coffeecup
Posts: 1367
Joined: Tue May 20, 2008 4:15 am

Re: Western Tang Stamps

Post by coffeecup »

Crossguard looks like iron; if so, that is largely a WWII trait (the use of brass was controlled as a strategic material). A shot of the pommel (if it still has it) will help date it a bit better.

By the production numbers, the knife is most-probably a G48-6 (6" blade, leather handle, sometimes referred to as a "Shark" knife) but might be a G48-5 (5" blade, leather handle, sometimes referred to as a "Baby Shark"). Lesser chance that it is a G48-8 (8" blade, leather handle, not common enough that it got a nickname I guess).
User avatar
TripleF
Bronze Tier
Bronze Tier
Posts: 18499
Joined: Mon Feb 14, 2011 3:42 pm
Location: West Central FL
Contact:

Re: Western Tang Stamps

Post by TripleF »

Is this from 1928- 1931, 0r 1935 - 1950 ?

It's the BOWIE knife:
Attachments
lot7.12.13 023.JPG
lot7.12.13 024.JPG
lot7.12.13 028.JPG
SCOTT
HOME OF THE BRAVE! (not the scarety cats)

Colonial Knife Company History ebook:
https://gumroad.com/l/ZLDb
coffeecup
Posts: 1367
Joined: Tue May 20, 2008 4:15 am

Re: Western Tang Stamps

Post by coffeecup »

Um, neither. The tang stamp dating estimates don't apply to this model.

The WWII-era version had a straight crossguard. Per Western, this knife was introduced as a commercial product in 1964. Based on examples of datable purchases, the mark on your knife was in use from '64-probably sometime in '66. Examples of the next stamp in the sequence (WESTERN/BOWIE/USA) were purchased as early as April 1967.

The sheath seems to be a later example, though it might be original to the knife. The sheath pivot was first cataloged in 1968. From examples of datable purchases, this sheath may have actually reached the market prior to August 1967, but the earliest example I'm aware of can be documented to that month and year.

So you have a nice example of the first version of the W-49 bowie; the sheath may be original or a replacement. It is a wonderful piece of kit, but dates to '64 at the earliest.

Jim
User avatar
tongueriver
Posts: 6834
Joined: Tue Sep 16, 2008 8:01 pm

Re: Western Tang Stamps

Post by tongueriver »

Excellent information, Jim; we all can thank you.
coffeecup
Posts: 1367
Joined: Tue May 20, 2008 4:15 am

Re: Western Tang Stamps

Post by coffeecup »

I hope it is helpful. I need to get in gear and get a synthesis of the information I've gathered on the W49 model posted in one block. With multiple data sources (published information, some examples where the purchases can be dated, and notes from interviews with a couple of former Western employees), it should be reasonably accurate. The big hangup is going to be gathering photos of examples: I'm too broke right now to go out and buy all the examples! :lol:
User avatar
TripleF
Bronze Tier
Bronze Tier
Posts: 18499
Joined: Mon Feb 14, 2011 3:42 pm
Location: West Central FL
Contact:

Re: Western Tang Stamps

Post by TripleF »

Thanks coffeecup. You inspired me to confirm or deny your statements.

Based on a couple other knife forum topics I am agree with your dating, AND I believe this was the first bowie knife produced with this tang stamp....I don't mean it was the first knife off the line, rather this was the original tang stamping used on the blade.
Western
Boulder, Colo USA

BOWIE
SCOTT
HOME OF THE BRAVE! (not the scarety cats)

Colonial Knife Company History ebook:
https://gumroad.com/l/ZLDb
coffeecup
Posts: 1367
Joined: Tue May 20, 2008 4:15 am

Re: Western Tang Stamps

Post by coffeecup »

Yeah, that is the first tang stamp used when the knife was introduced as a commercial product. Rivet size--"small" relative to later rivets--is another clue that it is an early knife.

On the rare later Westerns done without bifurcated tangs (like the W49), the tang stamp rules for dating don't apply. It almost looks like we'll have to work out model- or pattern-specific dating guidelines.

Jim
Mossdancer
Gold Tier
Gold Tier
Posts: 2484
Joined: Sun Oct 09, 2005 11:50 pm
Location: S.W. Wa.

Re: Western Tang Stamps

Post by Mossdancer »

coffeecup :
Hi Jim, Although not a bowie interesting anyway. Nice stamp of a West-Cut. My question is it does not have the split tang. Is it before the patent or a newer example.
I don't know if it will help but I also gave a close up of the pommel rivet.
moss
Attachments
PICT0001 (2) (800x376).jpg
PICT0002 (2).JPG
PICT0003 (2) (800x600).jpg
PICT0004 (2) (800x379).jpg
PICT0005 (2) (800x204).jpg
PICT0006 (2) (800x599).jpg
I STAND FOR OUR NATIONAL ANTHEM
coffeecup
Posts: 1367
Joined: Tue May 20, 2008 4:15 am

Re: Western Tang Stamps

Post by coffeecup »

Moss, my hunch is that your knife was an SFO made for Western. Definitely not a split tang, but the knife definitely post-dates adoption of the split-tang construction. (Aside from the tang stamp, look at the pommel: they adopted that form after the split-tang. Some of the early split-tang knives still have the earlier "mushroom" pommel.)

Western was pretty-heavily committed to the split tang, doing a knife like this would have required extra work, so I don't think it was done in-house. From what I've been told by a couple of guys who worked for Western, they were still doing this occasionally as late as the 1970s, but I've never seen one. I wonder who made it--Camillus?
Mossdancer
Gold Tier
Gold Tier
Posts: 2484
Joined: Sun Oct 09, 2005 11:50 pm
Location: S.W. Wa.

Re: Western Tang Stamps

Post by Mossdancer »

Back again;
Jim, here is I think an example of the next model you spoke of a couple of posts back.
After putting 2 and 2 together I think the original leather may have rotted in the South Viet Nam jungle and a small Red fox offered his hide as a repair for the sheath in the field. Check the thinness of the skin (that is a common dental pick for size).The thickness would to me indicate adapting to live in a hot humid clime. Sheath has the small rivet you referred too. The water hole is present in the lower shot. Could all this rhetoric be viable or not. For anyone who may not know I have added a pic of a later w 49 handle with the large rivets.
moss
Attachments
PICT0001 (800x425).jpg
PICT0002 (800x600).jpg
PICT0003 (800x600).jpg
PICT0004 (800x600).jpg
PICT0005 (800x600).jpg
PICT0006 (800x600).jpg
PICT0007 (774x800).jpg
PICT0008.JPG
PICT0001 (800x400).jpg
I STAND FOR OUR NATIONAL ANTHEM
tygr
Posts: 1
Joined: Fri Sep 12, 2014 4:13 pm

Re: Western Tang Stamps

Post by tygr »

I'm brand new to the forums and I'd love it if someone could help me identify my Western knives; age, model, style, etc. I really know nothing about knives in general, so anything would be helpful.

I don't have an image of the imprint on the tangs right now, but I do know they say

WESTERN
Boulder, Colo
Pat'd Made in USA

Thanks in advance!
Attachments
2014-09-11 18.56.55.jpg
2014-09-11 18.57.16.jpg
Post Reply

Return to “Western Cutlery Collector's Forum”