One weird Case 6265…hoping to “repair” it

[Walleye]

This is an odd one - recent eBay purchase. I got it pretty cheap but I knew going into it, there was a bit of a gamble here.

Based on the tang stamps, it’s a 2010 Case 6265. No handle scales present. The knife looks mostly unused, maybe even unsharpened, but it’s got serious issues. The entire knife is covered in a grey scale. There is still some snap to the blades but the springs feel kinda weak. The seller claims that a family member had lost it on some land he was clearing, and then at some point after plowing the land and doing some controlled burnings, he found the knife again. So, exposure to elements, possibly being burned and/buried in the ground. It doesn’t have any odd chemical or solvent odors, and it doesn’t look like anything has been done to clean it off - no evidence of sanding or wire wheel cleaning.

The steel parts of the metal don’t have the telltale rainbow discolorations that you’d expect to see if it was exposed to high heat, but I suppose that also doesn’t mean it wasn’t heated hot enough for it to screw up the steel and/or spring temper.

I’d really like to take this to the fiber or wire wheel and clean it to bare metal and put some new handles on it but I don’t want to polish the proverbial “turd”. If the steel or springs are too soft to hold an edge, it would be worthless for everyday use. Has anyone come upon a knife that looks like this and if so, what did you do?

If the blades were carbon steel, I might try disassembling it and rehardening / tempering them but stainless - not sure how to do that. I have also considered finally buying one of those Rockwell file sets - what should the approximate hardness of modern Case stainless blades and springs be? Does anyone here have a real Rockwell tester or any other suggestions to test the hardness with home methods?

See photos!

[1967redrider]

I wonder if this knife was in a fire?

[ThatWeirdKnifeGuy]

I'd say its been through the fire

The scale pins are missing, so it didn't just burn the scales, it melted the pins or disfigured them enough that they could fall free. I'm not an expert, so I really don't know if brass melts at or near the critical temperature of carbon steel. If it has indeed been heated past critical and lost its hardness, I would imagine that rehardening it would be risky. That would be the third time its been heated.

If it were me I'd put burnt stag on it, leave the blades and bolsters as they are and put it in a display. It's got a cool origins story

[OLDE CUTLER]

Does it have any snap? If the spring is soft from being in a fire, I would think it would bend.

[Jeffinn]

You can use a regular file and see if it “skates” off of the blades or springs. If it does then the heat treat and temper are probably okay. If the file bites into the metal then re-heat treating is an option. For re-heating and tempering you would need to know what steel you’re working with. For alot of stainless steel the heat treating recipe is similar.
Personally, I’d clean it up, put some scales on it and use it for awhile. If the springs and blades have been overheated you’ll likely notice the spring weakness in a short amount of time.
Jeff

[Walleye]

Does it have any snap? If the spring is soft from being in a fire, I would think it would bend.

Yeah it has some snap, but more like the snap you’d expect from a worn out 50 year old knife. That said, I rarely buy new Case knives so I don’t have a good feel for what a 2010 Case ‘65 pattern should snap like.

Let’s put it this way: it doesn’t snap like a modern Rough Ryder, that’s for sure - whole different issue, I know but I couldn’t resist

[Walleye]

You can use a regular file and see if it “skates” off of the blades or springs. If it does then the heat treat and temper are probably okay. If the file bites into the metal then re-heat treating is an option. For re-heating and tempering you would need to know what steel you’re working with. For alot of stainless steel the heat treating recipe is similar.
Personally, I’d clean it up, put some scales on it and use it for awhile. If the springs and blades have been overheated you’ll likely notice the spring weakness in a short amount of time.
Jeff

Good idea with the file. I’d assume it would bite somewhat but I can tell the difference between annealed steel and hardened steel when hit with a good quality file. Not sure how springs should feel under a file as I rarely would have occasion to file them. Still, sharpening and carrying it and using it would likely reveal a lot.

[Walleye]

Update: after looking at the knife a little closer last night, I don’t think it got hot enough to melt the brass handle pins, as there is evidence that some were pried out. Also the brass main back spring pin appears to have been filed down and then crudely peened flush with the liners. There is also evidence of some file work to smooth the liners and part of the bolsters on the top of the knife.

I’m figuring it might have been found with burnt or otherwise damaged handles that were then popped off, the center pin leveled with the liners and some clean up attempted, and then for whatever reason they gave up. Who knows

[Modern Slip Joints]

It has odd notches, almost a fish scaler, on the skinner blade. I think they were deliberatly added before it was lost.

The web site Zknives wrote Case Surgical Steel is 420HC, the most common alloy in Buck knives. I think that covered 2010 but Case may have changed stainless steels.

Please keep us up-dated or show us the repaired knife.

[Bill DeShivs]

If the knife was in a fire hot enough to melt the pins, the brass liners would have melted also.
I doubt it was in a fire-just exposed to the elements.
A file won't "skate" on these old blades.

[just bob]

It has odd notches, almost a fish scaler, on the skinner blade. I think they were deliberatly added before the fire. The web site Zknives wrote Case Surgical Steel is 420HC, the most common stainless alloy in Buck knives. I think that covered 2010 but Case may have changed stainless steels.

Please keep us up-dated or show us the repaired knife.

Those odd notches are called jimping. They are used to hold your finger in place when skinning and they are covered in blood and fat. I don't see a big deal here. Most modern knives are just used lightly. I'd clean this up and use it as is. You don't run a trapping line - do you? It will cut wood or paracord when cleaned and sharpened. I may have a set of pakkawood handles for this but there are so many that are so close. It would require exact measurements on your part.

[Walleye]

It has odd notches, almost a fish scaler, on the skinner blade. I think they were deliberatly added before the fire. The web site Zknives wrote Case Surgical Steel is 420HC, the most common stainless alloy in Buck knives. I think that covered 2010 but Case may have changed stainless steels.

Please keep us up-dated or show us the repaired knife.

Those odd notches are called jimping. They are used to hold your finger in place when skinning and they are covered in blood and fat. I don't see a big deal here. Most modern knives are just used lightly. I'd clean this up and use it as is. You don't run a trapping line - do you? It will cut wood or paracord when cleaned and sharpened. I may have a set of pakkawood handles for this but there are so many that are so close. It would require exact measurements on your part.

Well, some people do expect high performance from their blade steels in modern time. I will say this: I compared the hardness of these blades against a modern Buck 112 Slim and the Buck blade tip will scratch the Case blades but not the other way around. Does anyone know if modern Buck stainless 420HC is typically tempered harder than modern Case 420HC? I'm not saying that the Case blades are soft, but they seem to be more like older carbon steels when hit with a file or, in this case, hit with a modern Buck blade.

I think the fear with spending too much time on this Case knife not really knowing the hardness of the steel would be: what if I was in the field with it and it came down to relying on this knife in an all out survival situation? If I know for sure that these blades are compromised, then it would be better to keep this a wall-hanger vs. daring to use it in the field. I don't agree that its safe to risk using knives that have been compromised, even if one thinks they are just using the knife to cut paracord. You never know when your next step could put you in a situation where your knife becomes your lifeline. Even if someone was walking through their house on a cold day - suppose the power went out and you fell through a rotting part of your floor and became trapped in your basement. You only have the one knife you happened to be carrying at the time, and what if you were, through this predicament, sentenced to a week of surviving in a cold basement with only one knife and your only source of food was tinned tuna that you had to cut through with your knife. You would really be disappointed with yourself if you weren't carrying your high performance knife in that case, right or right?

[edge213]

It has odd notches, almost a fish scaler, on the skinner blade. I think they were deliberatly added before the fire. The web site Zknives wrote Case Surgical Steel is 420HC, the most common stainless alloy in Buck knives. I think that covered 2010 but Case may have changed stainless steels.

Please keep us up-dated or show us the repaired knife.

Those odd notches are called jimping. They are used to hold your finger in place when skinning and they are covered in blood and fat. I don't see a big deal here. Most modern knives are just used lightly. I'd clean this up and use it as is. You don't run a trapping line - do you? It will cut wood or paracord when cleaned and sharpened. I may have a set of pakkawood handles for this but there are so many that are so close. It would require exact measurements on your part.

Well, some people do expect high performance from their blade steels in modern time. I will say this: I compared the hardness of these blades against a modern Buck 112 Slim and the Buck blade tip will scratch the Case blades but not the other way around. Does anyone know if modern Buck stainless 420HC is typically tempered harder than modern Case 420HC? I'm not saying that the Case blades are soft, but they seem to be more like older carbon steels when hit with a file or, in this case, hit with a modern Buck blade.

I think the fear with spending too much time on this Case knife not really knowing the hardness of the steel would be: what if I was in the field with it and it came down to relying on this knife in an all out survival situation? If I know for sure that these blades are compromised, then it would be better to keep this a wall-hanger vs. daring to use it in the field. I don't agree that its safe to risk using knives that have been compromised, even if one thinks they are just using the knife to cut paracord. You never know when your next step could put you in a situation where your knife becomes your lifeline. Even if someone was walking through their house on a cold day - suppose the power went out and you fell through a rotting part of your floor and became trapped in your basement. You only have the one knife you happened to be carrying at the time, and what if you were, through this predicament, sentenced to a week of surviving in a cold basement with only one knife and your only source of food was tinned tuna that you had to cut through with your knife. You would really be disappointed with yourself if you weren't carrying your high performance knife in that case, right or right?

If you have a rotten spot in the floor of your house that you may fall through you should fix it before spending money on this knife. Also, if I had this spot I would be more disappointed in myself that I didn't fix it than what knife was in my pocket.

[just bob]

if you were, through this predicament, sentenced to a week of surviving in a cold basement with only one knife and your only source of food was tinned tuna that you had to cut through with your knife. You would really be disappointed with yourself if you weren't carrying your high-performance knife in that case, right or right

I've never been sentenced to a week of living in a cold basement and I doubt 99.9% of the earth's inhabitants have either, so I can't speculate on that scenario. If I were ever shipwrecked on a deserted island, I might have wished I would have followed your warning, but that seems most unlikely. I have used a pocketknife in the field many times and have found that a sharp blade works wonders. Prepare for the unexpected, not the impossible. I was also a boy scout - years ago.

[tinkerer]

Just a suggestion but would it be worth it to find a reputable heat treater that you could send the springs and blades off to for re-treatment? I don't know if it's cost effective or even a good idea given you're guessing at the steel but it could solve the hardness problem if they got it right.

[Modern Slip Joints]

Since at least since the 1960s standard grade stainless Buck blades have been harder than standard grade stainless Case blades so your scratch test needs to be compared to how easily your Buck's point scratches a good Case stainless blade.

Here's my amateur suggestion. Always carry three other knives in case you are atacked by lions and tigers and bears (oh my) and to handle survival in your basement. While equiped with them, after minimal clean up, use your questionable Case to open packages, whittle, work in your yard and in your kitchen. After a few resharpenings you'll have a good idea if its blades were softened by heat.

[edge213]

If I get trapped in my basement, it's all good.
I have plenty of beer and frozen pizzas!
Not to mention a lot of knives.

[ThatWeirdKnifeGuy]

Always carry three other knives

Words of wisdom

If I get trapped in my basement, it's all good.
I have plenty of beer and frozen pizzas!
Not to mention a lot of knives.

More words of wisdom.

[Bill DeShivs]

Why would you think these Case blades are stainless?
They aren't.

[Mumbleypeg]

After reading through the posts in this thread my only thoughts are,

1. why waste your time and money on the knife?

2. You should join in on the next AAPK POS exchange.

Ken

[Modern Slip Joints]

Why would you think these Case blades are stainless?
They aren't.

The O.P. wrote his Case is stainless in his first post. I presumed he'd read its tang stamps. They're not easily seen in his pictures if they can be read at all.

[...]
If the blades were carbon steel, I might try disassembling it and rehardening / tempering them but stainless - not sure how to do that. I have also considered finally buying one of those Rockwell file sets - what should the approximate hardness of modern Case stainless blades and springs be? [...]

[...]
1. why waste your time and money on the knife?
{...}
Ken

Maybe he's entertaining himself and the rest of us less expensively than drinking in the tavern or anything else in the businesses in town.

[ThatWeirdKnifeGuy]

Why would you think these Case blades are stainless?
They aren't.

The O.P. wrote his Case is stainless in his first post. I presumed he'd read its tang stamps. They're not easily seen in his pictures if they can be read at all.

[...]
If the blades were carbon steel, I might try disassembling it and rehardening / tempering them but stainless - not sure how to do that. I have also considered finally buying one of those Rockwell file sets - what should the approximate hardness of modern Case stainless blades and springs be? [...]

[...]
1. why waste your time and money on the knife?
{...}
Ken

Maybe he's entertaining himself and the rest of us less expensively than drinking in the tavern or anything else in the businesses in town.

I must admit, the frozen basement tuna nightmare survival left turn that the maybe-control-burn-toasted Case restoration quandry post took has been most entertaining.

Can I again recommend burnt stag for the new handles

[Walleye]

Why would you think these Case blades are stainless?
They aren't.

Uhhhh … they are stainless. It’s a 2010 knife and the skinner blade is marked “SS”. Why would you think they aren’t stainless ?

[Walleye]

After reading through the posts in this thread my only thoughts are,

1. why waste your time and money on the knife?

2. You should join in on the next AAPK POS exchange.

Ken

1. Wasting time and money on fixing knives is a fun hobby.

2. Where do I sign up?

[Walleye]

Why would you think these Case blades are stainless?
They aren't.

The O.P. wrote his Case is stainless in his first post. I presumed he'd read its tang stamps. They're not easily seen in his pictures if they can be read at all.

[...]
If the blades were carbon steel, I might try disassembling it and rehardening / tempering them but stainless - not sure how to do that. I have also considered finally buying one of those Rockwell file sets - what should the approximate hardness of modern Case stainless blades and springs be? [...]

[...]
1. why waste your time and money on the knife?
{...}
Ken

Maybe he's entertaining himself and the rest of us less expensively than drinking in the tavern or anything else in the businesses in town.

I must admit, the frozen basement tuna nightmare survival left turn that the maybe-control-burn-toasted Case restoration quandry post took has been most entertaining.

Can I again recommend burnt stag for the new handles

I am not a fan of burnt stag, but I see why you think it would go good on this. I was thinking more along the lines of making new side plates out of 1/8” aluminum rather than trying to fit new scales to these banged up factory liners. An all aluminum handle appeals to me and if this ever ends up as part of tackle box equipment it would be an easy clean solution.

I have also considered making it a lightweight knife, with handle scales of 1/8” black or OD green G10, sort of like the old LT series from years back. Only the center liner would stay and the sides would be solid G10.

Have also thought about curly maple or some Osage wood that I have small scraps of pinned to the brass like the originals but then I’d need to find a Case shield (I have some but would t want to “waste” it on this knife) because if I’m going to go through the trouble of re-pinning to the factory liners, there has to be a shield on there or the knife will look WRONG as can be. No large Case knife with scales and bolsters should be without a Case shield, that would be as wrong as rain is right.

I have also considered making this a single blade only knife, as the two blades kind of make this knife a bit heavier than it needs to be. So maybe the clip blade with the factory liners and something resembling a factory style scale set with Case shield would be one knife, and then the slimmer blade and spring would be installed in some oak handle scales making a super light beater folder in the grand style of the European friction folders of yore, but with a backspring. Think of a rustic, lightweight knife to throw in the spare tire well of your car, for those emergency times when you might need something to strike fire or make a tent stake in the wilds of nature after your car has careened off the roadway and all of the other knives you might have been carrying bounced out of your pocket as the car came to a halt, and flew out the window and over a cliff and into the valley below. You would be glad that you had a rustic no nonsense Case lightweight quasi primitive knife tucked away in the car, shielded from vibration and bouncing when you finally came to rest and were triaging your survival priorities, right or right??