Knives from PA

[Miller Bro's]

How about a couple boxes?

[peanut740]

MB,that Penn box is actually a cloud WR Case box wirh a Penn label stuck on it.

[doglegg]

How about a couple boxes?

Wonderful ephemera.

[Ridgegrass]

Here's a 2-5/8" Congress from PENNSYLVANIA KNIFE Co., Tidioute, PA, 1914-1921. Pressed bone or horn,or worn stag (?).Only American-made knife I've ever seen or had in pressed bone if it is, J.O'.

[Ridgegrass]

Notice in the corners of the tang above the mark are the symbols A and 1. Does anybody have an explanation for those. The Mark, "A-1" , was a Novelty Cutlery Co. of Canton, OH mark. J.O'.

[Miller Bro's]

MB,that Penn box is actually a cloud WR Case box wirh a Penn label stuck on it.

Roger, check out this link:
https://www.allaboutpocketknives.com/kn ... 25#p346606

Twelve years ago, scroll down.

[Miller Bro's]

Wonderful ephemera.

Thanks Floyd

[Miller Bro's]

. Pressed bone or horn,or worn stag (?).Only American-made knife I've ever seen or had in pressed bone if it is, J.O'.

No such thing as pressed bone, pressed horn yes

[Ridgegrass]

I respectfully disagree. Too late tonight. Stay tuned, O'.

[wlf]

Here's a 2-5/8" Congress from PENNSYLVANIA KNIFE Co., Tidioute, PA, 1914-1921. Pressed bone or horn,or worn stag (?).Only American-made knife I've ever seen or had in pressed bone if it is, J.O'.

It's a German knife, so still no American manufactured knife with pressed stag,as indicated by the distinctively German small o. The A-1 is different than the Tidioute, PA manufacturer as noted by Goins. We need to get that handle material to a forensic laboratory.

[Ridgegrass]

This is a continuation of another conversation on the bone/horn subject. Bone, being living, growing, repairable tissue has a rich blood supply. When viewed under a microscope, the old capillaries in bone show up as tiny dark thread-like structures. In some samples, they are even visible to the naked eye.
Horn is not living tissue. It grows like hair and nails and is "dead", having no blood supply. It is a somewhat fibrous protein called keratin. The Wostenholm knife below is pressed bone. I wish I could take a photo under my 40 power dissecting scope to show everyone the very obvious capillaries in the handles but, alas, you'll have to take my word that they are there.
The other photo is a piece of cattle horn. The fibrous structures are without blood capillaries.
The Pennsylvania Knife Co. piece from the OP is so scratched up I can't tell what it is even under the scope.
I'm not trying to win any argument here, just stating again what I observe under the scope. I have read of pressed horn and, pressed bone.
My background is 31 years of teaching Biology, Zoology, Anatomy and Physiology. That doesn't make me any great authority, but I've seen a lot of tissues under the microscope lens and those handles are run through with capillaries.

As for the OP knife. Lyle, I appreciate the A-1 reference. I didn't find it in Levine or Price. Oddly there's no "Germany" on the mark. Levine says" Pennsylvania Knife Co. ?PA USA Mfr.?" and, " Pennsylvania Cutlery Co. Tidioute, PA Germany? Import?" 1914? Confusing.

[Ridgegrass]

Forgot the pics, Duh!

[Ridgegrass]

Cattle horn.

[Ridgegrass]

Thomasg sent me this clip during the last discussion of this subject. I don't know where its from. Maybe he'll join in. O'.

[Ridgegrass]

Here's the old post from thomasg.

[wlf]

the link to thomasg's article :
https://journals.openedition.org/artefact/1237#tocto1n7

This is the first I've seen of pressing bone , I could never identify the material.

I have always believed this was an old process used by European manufacturers, because those covers have never been substantiated as made by an American manufacturer. Another reason is the opaqueness they acquire, losing their color over time and usage.
Thanks John for delving deeper.

Pics of the presses. The bottom one was to press bone.? I'd still like to have it forensically analyzed.

[LKSKNIVES]

Now that I look at an earlier post I’m confused.
Can you guy’s please help.

The stamp looks like Crandol not Crandall.
Definitely one L.
Thank you in advance.


I posted a couple of pictures of this knife on the what are you carrying today. Yes I carried it.I have looked at it a few times over the past 16yrs, never really paid attention to it. Now that I’m more of a participant in dad’s knives while also selling them for us 4 Old kids. I have developed a liking for the elephant toe style. That is why I put it in my pocket. I noticed a long time ago the broken blade. Took a couple pictures the other day noticed the pin crack on one side and the crack on the other side running the full length. Last night I pulled out my pixel magnifying glass and took a closer look. I don’t think it was my dad. Someone actually tried to stabilize the big crack. I can see material on each end of the knife.
Anyway enjoy this Crandal PA knife. Forgot to say it has definitely been used. Not sure if you would say abused knowing how old it is. It had a purpose in the day.
Steve
I actually have my eyes on one in one of our members store. Still not collecting just a couple different ones to put in my pocket rotation.

[Ridgegrass]

Thanks for the reprint Lyle. I'm going to try to find someone with a dissecting scope with photo capability.There's no reason to think bone can't be chemically softened with a variety of acids to remove some amount of the calcium (vinegar being the most common), then heated and pressed just as easily as horn. Horn is even easier as it lacks the calcium-induced hardness of bone and can be formed with simple boiling.
John

[btrwtr]

As easy as it is to dye and jig bone why would anyone want to go to all the trouble, expense and time it would take to try to press bone? Could you possibly press bone isn't the point, the point is why would anyone even try? Pressing horn was done to get horn to look like something other than horn, typically bone or stag. Would you go to all the trouble of trying to press bone to make it look like pressed horn? I don't think so. The idea itself is unreasonable.

[Ridgegrass]

Who knows the "why" about a lot of old processes. Maybe it's just as easy to press a pattern into a bunch of thin pieces of bone as it is to hand jig then one by one. As I said a few times now, and the evidence seems to bear out, (the article above shows someone had a piece of equipment made to press bone), I have a knife that looks like pressed horn but is definitely made of bone. This is just an interesting discussion related to our hobby, not intended to be a bone of contention. J.O'.

[wlf]

We do need a forensic report, put this to bed. I've been questioning this for many years after I noticed that no American manufacturer ever put it on their knives.

[Ridgegrass]

I live near Salisbury University and I'm going to try to find someone who may be able to do a pic through a microscope. J.O'.

[PA Knives]

I can not comment on the handles of the Pennsylvania knife but WLF is spot on. That is a German knife not Tidioute. The second give away is the pins on the bolsters. German vintage knives almost always reveal the pins. I know a little about Tidioute knives

[msteele6]

LKSKnives, It looks like your post got a little lost, however, I would venture the opinion that the last 'L' in "Crandall" was simply broken or otherwise incapacitated when the tang stamp was used. The first thought that flashed through my mind when I saw the knife was "Robeson" because of the two slanting wormgrooves on the front handle of the knife, however I believe that the knife is an original Crandall. Crandall was related to Case and these same slanting wormgrooves would later show up on the post WWII rough black handled knives marked Case/XX.

[PA Knives]

Obviously, this is my favorite thread and I like to revive it occasionally. Here are two gorgeous Pearl-handled Tidioute-made knives. The fishtail is a first for me. I absolutely love this historic old knife. This would be the second Tidioute Cutlery. The curved stamps are the first indicator They don't come any sweeter than this. Next is a Union Razor Tidioute. Again in Pearl. Take note that the secondary blade has the Tidioute stamp as well. 99.9% of original names from Tidioute have the secondary blades stamped. Write that down a hundred times. It will save you a lot of money.