All About Pocket Knives

Does anyone see any problems with this knife? Seller says that he was advised that the knife was not original. Jigged bone handles, steel liners.

Right!! Never even thought about the missing shield. Thanks JW

Has the early can opener is like on the ULSTER DWIGHT DIVINE & SONS.What does the tang stamp say.
It could be a bits knife.
Grant
http://www.ebay.com/itm/ULSTER-DWIGHT-D ... ble_Knives

Just Ulster/Knife/Co. in three lines. No other blades marked, Dwight Divine. I think I'll probably let this one go. Thank you all for your comments

The knife ended up selling for $130.50

http://www.ebay.com/itm/201090383337?_t ... EBIDX%3AIT

Wow!

One guy comes in and triples the bid, then gives it to the next bidder. Either something fishy or pure stupidity. I opt for stupidity!

Randy

For the record, I purchased this knife and my top bid was $150 I believe. I am new to the forum but a seasoned scout knife collector. This knife with NO SHIELD is documented at the top of page 30 in Kerr's 600 Scout Knives book as UBR01BR. While BSA didn't have many knives with no shield, there were a number of them that were manufacted with an "etch only" (Ulster, PAL, Kingston, Imperial, Camillus). There is also some debate that a few of the war era knives may or may not have been official and may have been assembled with left over parts for the war effort.

Welcome to AAPK ronfish. Glad to have you join us.

Let me invite you to share some of your scout collection on this thread........

http://www.allaboutpocketknives.com/kni ... 35&t=12874

ronfish,

Just saw this post and the knife looks very interesting. Everything looks correct to me with the exception of the missing shield and the bail. I would think the missing shield could well be a war time knife or made from left over parts as you said. The bail looks like an Ulster USA bail (as opposed to an earlier Ulster Knife Co. bail) and could well be a later left over transition as well. Does the Kerr's 600 Scout Knives book knife have the same type bail as this knife?

It is my understanding in that in war years the Boy Scouts were hard pressed for knives and this resulted in some strange variations of "Official Knives". I once owned a mint condition, green plastic handle, fixed blade PAL RH204 that had a full Official Scout etch. I've never seen another example of this knife but am certain it was authentic. I am quite sure this knife was the result of the need for scout knives in the WWII era as well.

The Cardinal fixed blade Official Scout knives were of very low quality as compared to other fixed blades and also reflected the lack of availability in WWII and post war era.

Wayne

Thanks Wayne, very interesting about the green PAL. As for the bail on this knife, I do believe it is correct and indicative of the time period. Kerr indicates that this no-shield model is likely from 1942, which correlates perfectly with the spare part era when some did not even have brass liners or spacers. I have several other examples of Ulster knives of the same time period in the early 40's that have the same style bail (official and unofficial). Picture below. It seems to be made of something other than nickel silver, as are the bails on the other war era knives.

People are very quick to judge scout knives at a glance and call out imperfections as "incorrect parts" or "fake because it has 2 different tang stamps" or "doesn't have a patent number, therefore it is a fake". Are there ridiculous fakes out there? Absolutely. Are there beautiful fakes with MOP scales or other fantastic modifications? Yep. Do people have one legimate artifact and compare all others to their example? You bet. However, anyone who has researched and acquired scout knives over the years can verify that there are many variations (parts or workmanship) within scout knives as a whole. PAL acquired Remington and assembled knives with new and old parts. Not fakes, just cross-over knives. Is it legit to call them an RS3333? Hmmm. Why are some Remington Scouts etched on the tang and not stamped? Perhaps PAL knows? Ulster/Imperial/Camillus swapped parts and made parts for each other, leaving it virtually impossible to sort out who actualy made some of their knives, in spite of the tang stamp.

I have acquired some amazingly well preserved display cartons from the 50's, 60's, 70's, 80's with 6 -12 knives MIB. Right in those display cartons, I have seen variations in the workmanship, parts and paperwork. Mirror finish with brushed finish main blades in the next box, different color papers in the same carton, different bail loops, different scale colors. Funny, I saw Kerr describe an example of the Imperial Carved Shield Model as "lighter handle color due to age and wear". Really? Because I opened up a brand new unused box of 6 of those and found very light tan and very dark red examples that were MIB!

In any case, thanks for reading my ramblings.

Ron

ronfish,

Always good to hear from someone that has so much specialized, hands on experience. I'll know where to go when I need an answer. Gotta love AAPK for that.

Wayne

I agree as well it was a war time example .
I have a fairly large collection of WWII era official boy and girl scout knives that I can post if theirs interest .

ScoutKnives wrote:I have a fairly large collection of WWII era official boy and girl scout knives that I can post if theirs interest .

I am patiently waiting for you to post more pictures of your scout knives over in the scout knife thread!

Miller Bro`s wrote:

ScoutKnives wrote:I have a fairly large collection of WWII era official boy and girl scout knives that I can post if theirs interest .

I am patiently waiting for you to post more pictures of your scout knives over in the scout knife thread!

I'm with ya on that Miller Bro's. Here's a link to that thread so that, hopefully, both you new folks can contribute to one of the longest running threads here on AAPK.

http://www.allaboutpocketknives.com/kni ... 35&t=12874

Not a Scout collector. I know little to nothing re' the subject matter of this thread.

But, during WWII Robeson did not put shields on their knives. They used black composition pressure molded handles with an impressed "ROBESON" in place of the shield and filled it with white paint for contrast.

I have no idea what the military uses for the components of nickel-silver might have been, but evidently, it was not readily available during the war.

Charlie Noyes

RobesonsRme.com wrote:I have no idea what the military uses for the components of nickel-silver might have been, but evidently, it was not readily available during the war.

During WW II Nickel was highly valued for use in armor plating in tanks and submarines for example. It was also used in the development of jet engines, Nickel was used as a strengthening agent to create new alloys.

In fact congress ordered the removal of nickle from the five-cent piece on October 8, 1942. From 1942 till the end of 1945, five-cent pieces were minted from an alloy of copper, silver and manganese.


Even after the war the need for stress and temperature resistance prompted the use of nickel alloys in the growing space race.

Thanks Dimitri.
That explains the presence of iron bolsters on knives whose pattern number calls for nickel-silver.
Charlie

What about this g.s. knife. Is this tang Stamp correct?

Thanks in advance
JamesG

Here is the entire knife

"Right as rain!". According to Goins' Encyclopedia, from 1876 until his death in 1933 Ulster was owned by Dwight Divine. At some point during that time his name was stamped on Ulster knives. His sons owned the company for several years after his death. I'm not sure when that period was when the Dwight Divine stamp was used but someone here probably knows. Ulster was a prolific maker of official scout knives so it's not uncommon to see that stamping on scout patterns, but you'll find them stamped with just Ulster also.

Ken

Thanks Ken! I certainly appreciate that info my friend. I get my Goins E Monday or Tuesday. I can't wait. I've developed a much deeper appreciation for Pocket knives over the last 4-6 months.
Thanks again
JamesG

Looks like not everyone with knowledge of knives was on aapk BECAUSE one of em was busy on ebay getting a good deal on a SCOUT KNIFE that people thought was fake!!! Good buy buddy

Thanks Andy

I submit for review another example of the Ulster Boy Scout knife that had a very interesting discussion back in 2014. There does appear to be some differences in that my knife has steel liners, steel spacer and steel pins. My knife has been lightly used and is very tight on all blades. If my knife is authentic the finish is not of the same quality as most of the other Ulster Boy Scout knives I own. I think the finish on the screw driver/bottle opener and the can opener are not of the same quality as others of the same period.
Your input would be greatly appreciated.