Page 1 of 1
Schatt and Morgan, did I get burnt?
Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2018 11:35 pm
by Simeone
Hi all,
First post here, I just recently started getting into traditional's and wanted to get an older S&M. I saw this on ebay and bought it. I never even thought about vintage counterfeit slipjoints till i saw these threads and got myself worried. What do you guys think of this?
Re: Schatt and Morgan, did I get burnt?
Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 12:12 am
by SteelMyHeart85420
I'm no Schatt & Morgan expert, but, I'd say original. Handle material is shrinking, in my mind it needs to be re-scaled, several skilled folks here could help you out, if you choose that route.
Re: Schatt and Morgan, did I get burnt?
Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 12:16 am
by doglegg
No expert here either. It is a nice looking knife and welcome to AAPK.
Re: Schatt and Morgan, did I get burnt?
Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 12:20 am
by OLDE CUTLER
Welcome to AAPK.
Nice looking knife.
Re: Schatt and Morgan, did I get burnt?
Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 1:02 am
by edge213
I say legit. They are shrunken a little, but I love the handles.
Re: Schatt and Morgan, did I get burnt?
Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 1:12 am
by jerryd6818
Welcome to AAPK. Glad to have you aboard.
Re: Schatt and Morgan, did I get burnt?
Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 1:26 am
by Simeone
Thank you for the welcome guys,
Good eye i did not notice that, however i have another S&M that is also all caps, i just checked it, all four blades are stamped all caps too. I would definitely like some other people to way in on this.
Re: Schatt and Morgan, did I get burnt?
Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 1:37 am
by TwoFlowersLuggage
Didn't Queen use that stamp (with the all caps "TITUSVILLE") on some of their S&M knives?
(not my knife - I pulled this pic off ebay)
Re: Schatt and Morgan, did I get burnt?
Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 1:50 am
by Simeone
TwoFlowersLuggage wrote:Didn't Queen use that stamp (with the all caps "TITUSVILLE") on some of their S&M knives?
s-l500 (2).jpg
(not my knife - I pulled this pic off ebay)
yes they did but there would be a stamp on the other side as far as i know. Usually "DFC" for Daniel Family Cutlery
Re: Schatt and Morgan, did I get burnt?
Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 2:38 am
by peanut740
They didn't put DFC on them until after 2012.
Re: Schatt and Morgan, did I get burnt?
Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 3:10 am
by Brumbydownunder
@Simeone Tang stamps should only ever be used as a guide and not 100% Gospel on a knife's authenticity - Tang Stamps get changed up all the time for special runs etc. From your pictures I would say the knife started out as Genuine & it's modern not pre 1932 ...but it appears to be re-handled as none of the pins are spun (Domed) and the shield is (???) The pile side may never have been stamped or could have been cleaned off when it was re-handled. There was a Heritage series that used that shield .... but .......
This is a Genuine S&M ... same tang stamp as yours - note the shield - most (not all) S&M of the modern era have this shield.
The other side of that Blade
And the pen blade that is only marked on one side
Absolutely my knife is genuine as it was gifted to me by one K. Ryan Daniels
Derek
Re: Schatt and Morgan, did I get burnt?
Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 3:35 am
by Simeone
Brumbydownunder wrote:@Simeone Tang stamps should only ever be used as a guide and not 100% Gospel on a knife's authenticity - Tang Stamps get changed up all the time for special runs etc. From your pictures I would say the knife started out as Genuine & it's modern not pre 1932 ...but it appears to be re-handled as none of the pins are spun (Domed) and the shield is (???) The pile side may never have been stamped or could have been cleaned off when it was re-handled. There was a Heritage series that used that shield .... but .......
This is a Genuine S&M ... same tang stamp as yours - note the shield - most (not all) S&M of the modern era have this shield.
DSCN7948.JPG
The other side of that Blade
DSCN7950.JPG
And the pen blade that is only marked on one side
DSCN7952.JPG
Absolutely my knife is genuine as it was gifted to me by one K. Ryan Daniels
Derek
Why did you write it off as not pre 32? Because most of the old S&M's i have seen have flat pins, and this shield is on half the knives in there old catalog from back then.
Re: Schatt and Morgan, did I get burnt?
Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 6:24 pm
by Billswfl
Here are two pictures from Jim Sargents 6th Edition page 314 which shows a knife similar to the op's.
Re: Schatt and Morgan, did I get burnt?
Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 7:40 pm
by RalphAlsip
I don't collect Shatt & Morgan as a brand so I won't be able to answer any Schatt & Morgan questions, but I happen to have a couple of examples in patterns that I collect in case pictures might be helpful.
Re: Schatt and Morgan, did I get burnt?
Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 8:33 pm
by msteele6
Authentic. Pre-WWII.
JMO
Re: Schatt and Morgan, did I get burnt?
Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 10:30 pm
by kootenay joe
I say OP knife is all original. It has not been worked on like re-handled etc. Obviously from examples shown S&M did have stamping dies with TITUSVILLE all in caps.
You are correct to be concerned about re-worked/fake vintage knives. They do exist so it is best to examine every knife closely before buying. Good pictures are how we mostly 'examine' now. Be wary of out of focus pictures.
kj