All About Pocket Knives

https://www.ebay.com/itm/194567547034?h ... SwY~dhqRnq

Oh gosh. The areas of focus on these photos is incredible. However in the one picture where the blades are closed, you can clearly see that the tang stamp appears to be a double struck mark.

Pronounced triangluar notches where the blade meets tang are also notoriously suspect. What has happened here? It looks like a genuinely old frame and bone. But something is clearly amiss.

All you need to know about that knife is the seller. AVOID!

That's a jazzygambling special! You'd better run the opposite direction.

With coins and stamps a marking error can increase the value. With knives it either has no effect on value or might slightly decrease value. Collectors want an example that is perfect in all regards.
kj

jazzygambling is not your friend.. ......

Nice frame. Kutmaster master blade. Looks like those they put in the fake stockman.

btrwtr wrote: ↑Wed Dec 08, 2021 12:41 am Nice frame. Kutmaster master blade. Looks like those they put in the fake stockman.

Does the frame look like a genuine Catt frame? It does to me. The spey blade might be original to the frame. The master blade is def. looking wrong and double stamp obscured by the focus of the photos is surely odd.

Looking at that spey blade, regardless of if its original to the frame or not, it looks like someone squared off a worn blade and then reground and buffed it. The thing that gets me, is the way whoever did it left that big undercut notch flush to the top of the tang...that is something I have seen on a lot of questionable knives over the years, leading me to think its one person doing it. I have an old IXL penknife with worn blades reprofiled and reground in the same way, with a big triangle notch at the blade/tang junction. However, I bought that knife almost 30 years ago, from someone in Tennesee who is no longer with us. If the "craftsman" is one and the same thats a long career of "cleaning up" beat-up knives.


22 mins left and this thing is AT $183!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Unbelievable!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

It seems to me that the Vast majority of Questionable, Reworked, and Counterfeit Knives come from Sellers in Tennessee and Kentucky. Have you noticed that?

56Dodgers wrote: ↑Wed Dec 08, 2021 1:45 am

btrwtr wrote: ↑Wed Dec 08, 2021 12:41 am Nice frame. Kutmaster master blade. Looks like those they put in the fake stockman.

Does the frame look like a genuine Catt frame? It does to me. The spey blade might be original to the frame. The master blade is def. looking wrong and double stamp obscured by the focus of the photos is surely odd.

Looking at that spey blade, regardless of if its original to the frame or not, it looks like someone squared off a worn blade and then reground and buffed it. The thing that gets me, is the way whoever did it left that big undercut notch flush to the top of the tang...that is something I have seen on a lot of questionable knives over the years, leading me to think its one person doing it. I have an old IXL penknife with worn blades reprofiled and reground in the same way, with a big triangle notch at the blade/tang junction. However, I bought that knife almost 30 years ago, from someone in Tennesee who is no longer with us. If the "craftsman" is one and the same thats a long career of "cleaning up" beat-up knives.


22 mins left and this thing is AT $183!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Unbelievable!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Sold for a bit over $230 incuding the shipping. I don't know that any part of this knife is Cattaraugus made. This seller doesn't care what the knife actually is. Cobbled, welded, frankenknives all too common. Not sure about the spey blade. It definately has been reground and profiled. Looking at it from the top view you can see that the blade width is cut down right at the tang. Who buys this junk from him and than leaves such great feedback? SAD.

I call them Tennessee "studs" and "moonshine magic".... and some of these "fakes" are contrived by once well known knife manufacturers.

The frame looks like a "pen trapper" frame similar to the Maher & Grosh "Diablo" pattern, which was likely made by Ulster.

To me the frame does not look like a Catt frame nor does the bone look like Catt bone.

At one point were were going to post a list of questionable sellers. almost all of them have 100% feedback as the smart ones take back the knives no question.

I propose we call it "in Loving memory of Myrtlefaye". LOL for those newer people Myrtlefaye had a lot of fakes made of of old parts Platts, catt, queen.

When should we put the list ? or where can we find the one that might exist ?

celluloidheros wrote: ↑Tue Jan 04, 2022 7:48 am At one point were were going to post a list of questionable sellers. almost all of them have 100% feedback as the smart ones take back the knives no question.

I propose we call it "in Loving memory of Myrtlefaye". LOL for those newer people Myrtlefaye had a lot of fakes made of of old parts Platts, catt, queen.

When should we put the list ? or where can we find the one that might exist ?

Not sure what liability issues might be involved.

There are a lot of fake old knives for sale on eBay. Some are one time sales by people that have been burned buying a fake knife and they are trying to unload them. Some are sellers that don't know old knives well enough to know that are selling a fake. Then, unforunately there are a few sellers that are educated enough to know they are selling fakes but they and eBay certainly don't care as the money is all the same to them. Repeat offenders that sell good and bad all the same. It's these few old knife sellers that frequently sell fakes that are the worst of the lot. If you peruse the counterfeit forum you will see these sellers come up frequently enough.

I am not at all well versed on the newer current production knife fakes but I know that they are for sale on eBay as well.

Im sure we could find a good title for our list of ebay sellers to double check.

eBay is chock full of garbage. But sometimes a gem can be found, you just need to do your research first. Once in a blue moon even ol' Sporty sells a knife that's legit.

Well, John, I have to respectfully disagree---I have purchased many legit knives from Sportcolbs...although, I will admit that I have seen plenty of his listings that are highly suspicious as well. Perhaps it's due to the volume of knives he sells and he simply doesn't have the time (or the knowledge) to verify the legitimacy of those he is not personally familiar with. But, as far as Mini Trappers go, the only "errors" that I have encountered in his listings is when he refers to them as "Trappers" instead of "Mini Trappers" and also not fully disclosing or clearly showing all the "issues" a knife may have. But, to his credit, he has always accepted returns without question and (so far) has not blocked me from buying or bidding just for making one return (like Bargainseller02 and 54rogers both have).

Slightly off topic for this thread, but while I'm on a rant...what really irks me is when a seller posts only a few photos, half of which are out of focus, that do not show things like tang stamps, blade centering, the pile side, etc., but instead put a disclaimer in the description to "ask questions before bidding or buying" because it's being sold "as is" and the seller does not accept returns. As far as I'm concerned, that's just plain lazy (bordering on deceitful) and unless it's a knife I really really want, I don't even bother to ask questions anymore since many of these lazy/deceitful sellers don't even bother to respond to questions that can't be answered by looking at their photos (such as the walk and talk snap or hard to see hairline pin cracks in the handle, etc.) YMMV.

Q, I think perhaps the knives you’re buying from Sporty are new enough that they’re not often faked. He sells a LOT of questionable older knives. To be sure he sells some good ones also (and typically gets top dollar for them - unfortunately he gets top dollar for the fakes too.) It’s buyer beware when looking at his listings - buyers need to know their stuff.

I know he accepts returns without question, and often that becomes justification for “being honest”. I couldn’t disagree more on that. I once questioned another frequent seller of fakes (not Sportcolbs) about several listings. He admitted he knew the knives were counterfeits. He said he offered unconditional no-questions asked returns and seldom did anyone take him up on that, therefore his customers must be satisfied with the fakes he sold them. And therefore in his mind he is an honest seller. That’s the same as saying you’re embezzling money from me but since I haven’t caught you, you’re not a crook!

Ken

A good faker, counterfeiter has to have enough good knives mixed in with the junk. if he has all junk even the most gullible collector will catch him. sporty sells about 500 to 1 I would say.. maybe 100 to 1. i stopped looking at his stuff awhile ago. he used to dump all Silverladdie's stuff back when he was around.

How many people know who SilverLaddie was is, is.. he might have been silverladdie57 ?

I forget where Sporty is from but I'm guessing it was Tennessee. I have nothing against SilverLaddie, he was a close friend and I have nothing bad to say about him.

I know who silverladdie is but ever met him. I knew his father and dealt with him both by mail order and at shows. Used to get his monthly sales letter - I posted copies of a few of those from the early 1970s in an older thread. viewtopic.php?f=2&t=59719&p=690560&hilit=Parker#p690560

Sportcolbs is still in business in Tennessee.

Ken

celluloidheros wrote: ↑Thu Jan 06, 2022 4:06 am A good faker, counterfeiter has to have enough good knives mixed in with the junk. if he has all junk even the most gullible collector will catch him. sporty sells about 500 to 1 I would say.. maybe 100 to 1. i stopped looking at his stuff awhile ago. he used to dump all Silverladdie's stuff back when he was around.

How many people know who SilverLaddie was is, is.. he might have been silverladdie57 ?

I forget where Sporty is from but I'm guessing it was Tennessee. I have nothing against SilverLaddie, he was a close friend and I have nothing bad to say about him.

If you sell on eBay you don't need to have good knives mixed in with fakes. Seller myrtlefaye never mixed in enough good knives to say so and he had 100% positive feedback. If he ever sold any good knives I can't say that I remember.

I agree Wayne. Another was tommygg101 - can't recall ever seeing anything but counterfeits from him either. IIRC he also had a 100% feedback rating, and he was a prolific seller of fakes.

Ken

Mumbleypeg wrote: ↑Tue Jan 11, 2022 4:45 am I agree Wayne. Another was tommygg101 - can't recall ever seeing anything but counterfeits from him either. IIRC he also had a 100% feedback rating, and he was a prolific seller of fakes.

Ken

Yep. I believe there’s a gang involved with all or many of those mentioned, not only helping sell bad knives, but shill bidding each other’s listings.

btrwtr wrote: ↑Tue Jan 11, 2022 3:21 am

celluloidheros wrote: ↑Thu Jan 06, 2022 4:06 am A good faker, counterfeiter has to have enough good knives mixed in with the junk. if he has all junk even the most gullible collector will catch him. sporty sells about 500 to 1 I would say.. maybe 100 to 1. i stopped looking at his stuff awhile ago. he used to dump all Silverladdie's stuff back when he was around.

How many people know who SilverLaddie was is, is.. he might have been silverladdie57 ?

I forget where Sporty is from but I'm guessing it was Tennessee. I have nothing against SilverLaddie, he was a close friend and I have nothing bad to say about him.

If you sell on eBay you don't need to have good knives mixed in with fakes. Seller myrtlefaye never mixed in enough good knives to say so and he had 100% positive feedback. If he ever sold any good knives I can't say that I remember.

Myrtlefaye had a ton or parts, I always wondered where he came up with all the parts. i bought one knife from him just to examine. i still have it. tommygg wow another blast from the past. I guess what I meant with the 100 to 1 comment was for a person to remain not known and a bad seller. Myrtle and Tommy were well known. Are those two still around ?

Funny how these fakes can resurface. Here is another eBay sale of the same fake Cattaraugus knife that was originally posted here. The knife sold for more money the first time around. I wonder if the buyer realized he had a fake to dump of if he thouoght he had a good knife he could flip for more money.

First sale was $225 plus, second sale was $175 plus.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/125108905010?n ... 7675.l2557

Here is a picture of the knife from the second sale.

Mumbleypeg wrote: ↑Tue Jan 11, 2022 4:45 am I agree Wayne. Another was tommygg101 - can't recall ever seeing anything but counterfeits from him either. IIRC he also had a 100% feedback rating, and he was a prolific seller of fakes.

Ken

Interesting thing about tommygg, Ken. He used to place pre-bids at all of the online auction houses but then never followed the auctions on auction days. So most often, if he won anything it was because no on site or online person put a bid in before the hammer dropped. Most of what he did win was legit and I never saw those knives listed in his eBay sales. Not sure what he did with them?