Old Keen Kutter Knives

[FRJ]

Thank you, Dan.

[jxr1197]

Sweet toothpick Joe!
This cattle knife showed up a few days ago as the mystery component in a bundle. The seller couldn't identify it for good reason. Even though it's in decent shape the tangs are just all pitted to hell. After a little clean up and with good lighting the Keen Kutter logos are visible but I can't tell if it has ears (I think it doesn't) and I can't tell whether it's got 'Simmons' on it. The pattern number is probably K7387?-3/4 and it's 3-5/8" closed without any brass - liners, pins - all of it is NS. It doesn't look Schrade to me and I don't think it's a Camillus. I'm wondering if it could be a Winchester?

[danno50]

Nice old knife, Jason. It could also be made by Walden. Is there any trace of a stamped pattern number on the back of the main blade?

[jxr1197]

Nice old knife, Jason. It could also be made by Walden. Is there any trace of a stamped pattern number on the back of the main blade?

Thanks Dan. It's tough to see but definitely there. K7387?-3/4. The last digit is unreadable and that 8 is questionable too. Could also be a 6 or a 3 or on a stretch maybe even a 5. The closest patterns are on page 201 (Sellens) but nothing exact.

[danno50]

A stamped pattern number, preceded by K, is an indication of Camillus manufacture. In my opinion, with the stamped pattern number, it is not Walden made. There are distinct differences in the spey blade shape between Camillus and Winchester made knives. However, the spey on yours is down considerably and I can't say. There is another member, msteele6, with a lot better feel for the differences between Camillus and Winchester Keen Kutters. Hopefully he comes by and offers his opinion.

[jxr1197]

Here's a tighter shot on the spey. I recall reading about the 'K' pointing to Camillus but I don't remember if it's an exclusive marking. What made me think it wasn't Camillus were the punch and the nail nick on the spear. Full disclosure - I'm likely to be wrong, lol. Thanks for looking.

[danno50]

Jason, if you look at the 6th post on page 23 of this thread, it gives some additional information on telling the difference between Winchester and Camillus knives. In particular, there is a description and references to posts depicting the differences in the spey blades. The spey blade on yours is worn down considerably? The referenced post also mentions ringed bolsters as being more indicative of Camillus manufacture, as opposed to Winchester.

[msteele6]

Knife appears to be a 73878 3/4 shown on p. 202 of Sellens.

I would say that the knife is a Camillus made knife based on the following, first the "K" in the pattern number, I generally only see that on Camillus made knives. I assume that the "K" is underlined. The grooved bolsters are common on Camillus knives, however, I haven't really seen it very often on Winchester or Walden knives. The Keen Kutter logo should have the little ears at the top of the wedge, if they aren't there I'd be surprised. Finally, the shield shown in Sellens is the old logo shield, however, if you look at Sellen's dates they are 1921 through 1938. At the beginning of that period the knife would have been a Walden knife, at the end a Camillus. This knife is a later version in my opinion. Camillus made knives both with and without the "Simmons" on the logo.

I can't see anything about the punch that sounds any alarms.

JMO

[edge213]

Latest KK Barlow

[jxr1197]

It looks like most signs are pointing to Camillus on that cattle knife - thanks Dan and msteele

Here's another, and this one's easy - it's an Ulster! Not in Sellens book but the pattern dates to 1960-1966.

[jxr1197]

I picked up another Ulster Keen Kutter. This is an 834 and sadly some ding dong along the way nearly cleaned the etch off. It can be seen at the right angle but the camera doesn't catch it well. Just like the K58OT above, this one has no tang stamp. It's likely made around the same time. That turkish clip makes it a 1960+ knife.

[jxr1197]

Keen Kutter 883. It's not in Sellens but it's identical to the KS835RB on page 157.

[jxr1197]

I'm wondering if someone on here might know if this is a Winchester or maybe a Camillus? There's no pattern number and the closed length is 3.5". The shape of the clip is distinct so hopefully this one's easy to ID. Thanks for any input.

[FRJ]

Here's a nice old knife that apparently has been recovered.
Sellens book says this should have Celluloid covers.
As it is, it has cracked jigged bone with a patch, thank you very much.
I love the spiral and those blades. And the pattern. And the stamp. And the nickel silver liners.
3 5/8" closed.

[danno50]

Nice knives Jason and Joe! Joe, the handle replacement looks like it was well done quite some time ago. With fairly full blades and that spiral punch it is a nice old knife.
Jason, Sharpshinyknives has one just like the one in your last post in his AAPK store. It is a very distinctive clip blade. I am at a loss on it as to where it fits in. The tang stamps, on yours and on the one in the AAPK store, do not look quite right for old Simmons era Keen Kutters. I would not be surprised if they were more recent remakes, possibly in the 60s by Val-Test Distributors??

[FRJ]

Thank you, Dan.
Yes, the covers have been on there a while.
Some one cared for this knife and rightly so.

[jxr1197]

Nice knives Jason and Joe! Joe, the handle replacement looks like it was well done quite some time ago. With fairly full blades and that spiral punch it is a nice old knife.
Jason, Sharpshinyknives has one just like the one in your last post in his AAPK store. It is a very distinctive clip blade. I am at a loss on it as to where it fits in. The tang stamps, on yours and on the one in the AAPK store, do not look quite right for old Simmons era Keen Kutters. I would not be surprised if they were more recent remakes, possibly in the 60s by Val-Test Distributors??

Thanks for the info Dan, I hadn't even thought of Val-Test because honestly I didn't know they owned the rights to Simmons tang stamps - that just adds a whole new layer of confusion to Keen Kutter knives. BTW I bought this one from sharpshinyknives on ebay - I hadn't seen the other one here.

[msteele6]

I've seen quite a few KK's in this pattern, can't remember seeing one that wasn't mint which always makes me think fake or "unauthorized" reproduction etc. It's hard not to assume this given the fact that E.C. Simmons name is on the tang. E.C. Simmons, of course, went out of business before WWII.

JMO

[BWT]

Here's a nice old knife that apparently has been recovered.
Sellens book says this should have Celluloid covers.
As it is, it has cracked jigged bone with a patch, thank you very much.
I love the spiral and those blades. And the pattern. And the stamp. And the nickel silver liners.
3 5/8" closed.

That's a good looking knife anyway Joe, I like the bone better than celluloid!!

[danno50]

I've seen quite a few KK's in this pattern, can't remember seeing one that wasn't mint which always makes me think fake or "unauthorized" reproduction etc. It's hard not to assume this given the fact that E.C. Simmons name is on the tang. E.C. Simmons, of course, went out of business before WWII.

JMO

Sellens say "The trademark name and logo" were purchased by Val-Test in 1960. Perhaps Val-Test used both the EC Simmons and Keen Kutter names?? However, you are probably right and they are unauthorized reproductions, but, are they "reproductions" if they are a pattern that EC Simmons never made?

[btrwtr]

The single clip blade with the blue handle is a more modern knife. I don’t believe it is a remake but rather more of a fantasy knife. There were quite a few handle color variations of them and they were more plentiful when first put out on the market 20 or more years ago. Not sure who was responsible for them.

[FRJ]

Thank you, Bill.
This bone does have some personality.

[KAW]

Picked up a couple of old Keek Kutters at the Lehigh Valley Knife Show last Saturday.
Hoping the folks here can tell me what pattern numbers they are and if the were made at the Walden factory?
Keeping my fingers crossed...

First the sleeveboard with the "rat tail" bolsters @ 3¼" closed...
Can someone tell me if the clip blade is the original shape or has it been ground down?


then there the Coke bottle Jack @ 3¾"...


Here's a group shot with the MoP steak? knife my girlfiend picked at the show.
Can't tell in the photo but it has the the "Simmons Keen Kutter" logo stamped in the middle of the blade & a patina that looks like tarnished silver. If anyone has more to add about this piece I'm all ears...

[peanut740]

Ken,from the picture your sleeveboard looks short.Close it and look down from the top and see how far from the opposite bolster the blade ends.
I don't know if Walden or Winchester made your cokebottle.I had a Winchester in that pattern with the double ringed bolster.Is that a weld spot on the back of the main blade?Regardless of that it is a nice knife.

[thefarside]

Ken,
I would take a hard look at your Coke Bottle, most old EC Simmons Keen Kutter's have all blades stamped with the keystone stamp. The pen blade in addition to not being stamped, doesn't appear to sit correctly in the frame in the open position.
Jim