Counterfeit Price!

[Robo]

This is a straight up legit 093 pattern Toothpick with a wicked muskrat blade--I love these! They can legitimately be called "rare" because you RARELY see these listed for sale anywhere. I have a theory that they were made by Utica on contract maybe because Case wanted to see how this blade type would fly with the public; or maybe they had a production gap to fill--who knows!? Anyway, I can't in all good concience promote this theory until I have one in hand that I can compare with my Uticas and 093s of "...& Sons" era. What I want to call out is the price! This price is counterfeit! There is know way this knife "rare" or not is worth the price this seller is asking. It's been sitting there as long as I've been heavily into this pattern which is roughly 2 years give or take for old-age memory loss. I e-mailed the seller once and tried to reason with him but he told me he's actually brokering this knife for another party and is powerless to lower the price. I would happily pay $300.00 for this knife--that's high--I know--but, like I said, the Muskrat blade/toothpick frame combo is awesome-- and I've got a theory to try and prove! Any one else out there find prices for a knife they desire to be frustratingly--but not legitimately-- out of the ballpark? https://www.ebay.com/itm/w-r-case-sons- ... 0009.m1982

[peanut740]

If the knife was dead mint it wouldn't be worth half the asking price.You can't tell much from the poor pictures,but what you can see is it is heavily pitted and used.If I owned it I would be happy to get $100 for it!

[gsmith7158]

I don't think that rusty old knife is going to sell for much more than $200 if that. I wouldn't waste my time on that one. The seller is dreaming!

[RalphAlsip]

The mark on the tang says “MADE IN U.S.A.” Instead of the more typical “BRADFORD PA.” For W.R. Case & Sons. I’m not questioning authenticity, but wondering if this indicates the knife was a contract knife made for Case by another manufacturer?

[Robo]

Ralf, I believe these were made by Utica and contracted by case. I don't like to speculate without examples in my possession, but I've acquired and closely studied a bunch of pictures of both Utica and Case toothpicks with the muskrat clip blade. I now also have two good examples of what I believe early Utica Toothpicks, one contracted to Cutino (which has the muskrat blade) and another with a regular clip blade which is either lacking a tang stamp or it wore off. None of this passes muster with me enough to make a definitive statement. But we're amongst friends here, so...UTICA! I'm interested in the USA stamping. Is it always a sign that the knife was contracted or are you saying that because The tang stamp usually has "Bradford" beneath the ...& Sons that it MIGHT indicate it's a contract job?

[msteele6]

Gerald Witcher's book on Counterfeit Cutlery shows the Case tang stamp with the "Made in USA" ( p.149) below and remarks that the stamping is generally believed to have been used on contract knives but further states that there is no evidence. I have a single example with the "Made in USA" (a 64055) that is not a Case made knife, it's a contract knife that I believe is Utica made.

JMO

[RalphAlsip]

I'm interested in the USA stamping. Is it always a sign that the knife was contracted or are you saying that because The tang stamp usually has "Bradford" beneath the ...& Sons that it MIGHT indicate it's a contract job?

Gerald Witcher's book on Counterfeit Cutlery shows the Case tang stamp with the "Made in USA" ( p.149) below and remarks that the stamping is generally believed to have been used on contract knives but further states that there is no evidence. I have a single example with the "Made in USA" (a 64055) that is not a Case made knife, it's a contract knife that I believe is Utica made. JMO

Rob, msteele provided a good answer to the question and like msteele said there is no authoritative proof that an authentic, but modified, stamp indicates contract knife, but it is believable to me. Here is picture of another example from a W. R. Case & Sons 8345 1/2 SAB that I believe was made by either Napanoch or Valley Forge. Note the “PENNA’ where “PA” would normally appear.

[msteele6]

I just realized that I actually have at least one other knife with the "Made in USA" stamping, a GS3038. Once again, this is a contract made knife, in my opinion, it has grooved/slanted bolsters and was made, I believe, by Utica. Again, Witcher states that there is no evidence, but there is the evidence of the knives themselves and I believe that my two examples argue for a contract made origin.

You might want to post this thread in the Case Collector's forum to get more thoughts, and, in particular, Steve Pfeiffer may notice and comment. You probably would need to change the title of the thread since it is not particularly enlightening.

JMO

[XxTestedxX]

This knife has been listed and overpriced longer than I have been collecting.

[wlf]

Lot of good advice I found interesting.