Schrade LB7 knifes with 3 pin and 4 pins

[hot tempered steel]

Could someone clear up the debate about the 3 pin and 4 pin Schrade LB7 knifes? I've heard that the 4 pin LB7 knifes, tang stamped Schrade+ over USA LB7 were the early made LB7's and then I've heard that the 4 pin LB7's tang stamped like that were only used for replacement knifes that were sent to customers for the Schrade lost knife warranty. I've heard that the 3 pin LB7 knifes tang stamped Uncle Henry Schrade+ over USA LB7 were the later production knifes and were made up until Schrade closed. I've got both, the 4 pin and the 3 pin LB7's, and I also have both of the Schrade USA Old Timer 7OT's with 4 pins and 3 pins (both in carbon steel, not Schrade+ steel). Does anyone know the truth about these knifes? Thanks. H.T.S.

[ea42]

H.T.S,,
The LB-7's were produced with four pins through the handles from 1978-1990, and changed to three pins from 1991 to production end in the wood fibron handles. The white delrin handled scrimshaw knives were reverted back to four pin at some point, but I don't recall when. The question about warranty replacement knives concerns the serial numbers. All the older 4-pin knives were serialized, but there are a few here and there that pop up without serial numbers, and these are the ones that it's suspected were factory replacement knives. I just sold one of those with the original box and paperwork, which lacked the warranty card. This seems to confirm that it may well have been a shelved replacement knife. The problem is there is no hard proof as yet to confirm this. Serialization was stopped at some later point on the three pin knives, but these have the addition of "Uncle Henry" on the tang, which I believe was added at the same time the three pin conversion took place. Hope this helps.

Eric

[hot tempered steel]

Thank you ea42, that info helps. Appreciate it. H.T.S.

[snorkel]

H.T.S,,
The LB-7's were produced with four pins through the handles from 1978-1990, and changed to three pins from 1991 to production end in the wood fibron handles. The white delrin handled scrimshaw knives were reverted back to four pin at some point, but I don't recall when. The question about warranty replacement knives concerns the serial numbers. All the older 4-pin knives were serialized, but there are a few here and there that pop up without serial numbers, and these are the ones that it's suspected were factory replacement knives. I just sold one of those with the original box and paperwork, which lacked the warranty card. This seems to confirm that it may well have been a shelved replacement knife. The problem is there is no hard proof as yet to confirm this. Serialization was stopped at some later point on the three pin knives, but these have the addition of "Uncle Henry" on the tang, which I believe was added at the same time the three pin conversion took place. Hope this helps.

Eric

I know this is a old thread, but the the 3 pin models where available in the mid eighties as I have one I bought when I was in high school and that was around 1985 or 1986.

I have taken apart a bunch of LB7s and they all have the holes in the liners for either 3 or 4 pin assembly. So why some are 4 vs 3 is not known to me but there where 3 pin models before 1990.

[ea42]

Snorkel, thanks for pointing that out, I don't know where I got that, as it should be around 1981-83, not '91. Serial numbers were dropped altogether around 1989-90. It's very difficult to nail down exact dates for these changes as there so far hasn't been a change order found that could exactly date the change.

Eric

[Aimus Moses]

Folks don't forget the #1 rule about Schrade knives. Anything is possible with them. Who knows, besides Schrade, why there were 3 pin knives and 4 pin knives made? Schrade made knives, not paper work. I don't think they ever planned on having their knives researched by future buyers and collectors. Schrade built their knives as tools that were to be used to serve a purpose and they didn't see a reason to record any paper work about them because it didn't bring in more money to them.

Aimus

[ea42]

I think it was simply a matter of cost and time. There's a lot of labor involved with putting six handle pins in per knife. Look at it this way, there were 70 steps involved in making an LB-7. That's from blanking the blade to the final finished product. If they could pin 87 pairs of handles per hour, and all the other steps could produce a minimum of 140 pieces or more per hour, then there's a bottle neck in the pinning and something had to be done to streamline it. They were probably able to at least bring it over 100 per hour with the elimination of those two pins. Saved money on brass wire as well. They tried it with the delrin handles as well, but the handles didn't stay put, so they had to switch back to four pins.

Eric

[snorkel]

What's interesting is they never removed the holes for the 4 pin model from the liners/bolsters.
Every single one I have taken apart has the counter sunk holes for a 4 pin with a hole in the middle for a 3 pin, so it's trivial from a customization point of few to make a 3 pin into a 4 pin model.

I thought I read somewhere that the 4 pin ones from the factory where the warranty replacement models and was a means to identify them.

[ea42]

That hole is a mystery for sure, I've got one of the first, #0185, and that too has a center hole, as do a couple of other early ones I have, altough the holes go from very small to quite large on them. I wonder if it initially served a different purpose, maybe to center a jig? I have no idea, although they're definitely not the replacement models. All of the early ones (somewhere around N3000 and before if I recall Codger's research correctly), had four pins, and the original blueprints and plans also called for four pins. If I can get a hold of one of the previous bosses over there, I'll run it by him, but that might take a while

Eric

[snorkel]

That hole is a mystery for sure, I've got one of the first, #0185, and that too has a center hole, as do a couple of other early ones I have, altough the holes go from very small to quite large on them. I wonder if it initially served a different purpose, maybe to center a jig? I have no idea, although they're definitely not the replacement models. All of the early ones (somewhere around N3000 and before if I recall Codger's research correctly), had four pins, and the original blueprints and plans also called for four pins. If I can get a hold of one of the previous bosses over there, I'll run it by him, but that might take a while

Eric

You think they would have done away with the holes in the liners, I mean someone had to drill and countersink them.
Here is a pic of a 3 pin I converted to a 4 pin, just used the two outer rear holes and it looks great:



I took apart a rough 4 pin model and it also had the hole for a single centered rear pin. Guess they just left their options open with them. Maybe certain limited edition models that used not as stable wood needed the extra pin so they just left it as is even though they had stopped making the 4 pin.

[garddogg56]

I have a three pin very tough knife

[garddogg56]

Snorkel, thanks for pointing that out, I don't know where I got that, as it should be around 1981-83, not '91. Serial numbers were dropped altogether around 1989-90. It's very difficult to nail down exact dates for these changes as there so far hasn't been a change order found that could exactly date the change.

Eric

I have a LB-7 three pin with a serial # built in 1991 go figure

[harmon]

I have one of these knifes that my Grandpa passed on to me when he died back in 1985. Not sure how long he had it. It has a stamp Schrade+ and then USA LB7 underneath. There is a serial # 668396.

Can anyone tell me anything about the knife and if it has any retail value?

Thanks,

Alan

[garddogg56]

I just picked up another LB7 3pin #Q14001 at a fleamarket,My first LB7 I got in 1991 #W47786-3pin

[knives-are-quiet]

I have one of these knifes that my Grandpa passed on to me when he died back in 1985. Not sure how long he had it. It has a stamp Schrade+ and then USA LB7 underneath. There is a serial # 668396.

Can anyone tell me anything about the knife and if it has any retail value?

Thanks,

Alan

My Brother has one of these knives. He bought it in 1980.
Don't know how much he paid for it back then.
But from the info on this site (articles and research / schrade / Uncle Henry knives) the LB7 is called a Bear Paw 5 inch lockback produced from 1979 true 2004. the last retail price was $62.95..
Wouldn't know how much yours is worth now, price wise. It would depend on it's condition.
My opinion is, If it was your Grandfathers then it is priceless.

J W

[orvet]

What's interesting is they never removed the holes for the 4 pin model from the liners/bolsters.

If you think about if from a manufacturing point of view it is not a real mystery.

They had the tooling to stamp out the liners with 4 holes. Why go to the expense to retool then just to delete a hole that did not show from the outside anyway? That one type of liner fit a number of different knives; LB-7, 7OT, LB-8, & the 507SC plus any SFOs they made on that frame.

It was not necessary to make dies with 3 holes, so why would they do it?
This is what seems logical to me.
We may never know the real reason unless we find out from one of the folks who worked there.

[Canuk sheathmaker]

I just picked up a 3 pin today with the laminated wood (diamond wood) scales, it has a serial number C64499. Is this knife post 1990? Thanks

Best regards

Robin

[loonyone]

I realize this is a very old thread so i initially apologize for that.
I lost my old, trusty LB7 some years ago and ended up finding it in almost the same condition, as far as the blade itself goes, but the bolsters look like they've been submerged in something as there are wormy-shaped etchings in them. That, and the lock spring is broken. I intend to restore it.
For the sake of arguments, I'd like to state that it is a 3 pin with rosewood scales, and has no serial number. This knife was new in i think 1979, i am the original owner. The original box and its warranty papers, along with the sheath are long gone.
Additionally, i intend to restore a 70T, in bad condition and a broken blade, by using a USA LB7 blade. Decent projects.
What can y'all tell me about these items?

[tongueriver]

Sounds like an interesting project; you undoubtedly have more talent than I. I just looked at ebay and there were 101 LB-7s for sale just in the obvious places, many of them dirt cheap. And more in some other corners. So I guess you know what I would do. It seems that the non-stainless Old Timer version is less common. Be sure to show us what you did with your construction project.